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#48171 - 01/23/08 12:44 AM Low Track versus High Track?
Pattayabowler Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 189
A/S/L: 54/M/USA/THAILAND
I've travelling back to the U.S. next month and plan to return to Thailand with a couple of new balls so I went to the bowling center yesterday and asked the Pro Shop operator to assist me in determining my PAP. I rolled two of my balls and he measured the first ball to indicate a PAP of 4 3/8" and 1/4" up. The second ball measured a 5" and 1/4" PAP. I guess I didn't maintain a consistent release so I guess I will use the average of the two when drilling my new balls.

We also determined that I am a low Track bowler. My Track line is around two inches or so from my thumbhole. I've read the defination as to how to determine low Track versus high Track, but I haven't read anything that discusses what effect low Track or high Track has on the performance of the ball. Is their an advantage to being a low Track or a high Track bowler? Being a low Track bowler, how should that affect my choice of ball layout (drilling)? I was thinking of drilling both balls stacked leverage.

Thanks,

Pattayabowler
_________________________
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Legends - Black Pearl - Medium to Medium/Heavy
Lane Masters - Sure Strike - Light to Medium
Hammer - Black Widow Pearl - Medium
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Legend

Registered: Fri Aug 27 2004
Posts: 10100
A/S/L: Mountain View, CA
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#48174 - 01/23/08 07:21 AM Re: Low Track versus High Track? [Re: Pattayabowler]
CoachJim Offline
USBC Silver Coach

Registered: 09/19/06
Posts: 4665
A/S/L: Reston, Virginia USA
There are two types of low Track player, 1. low Track low rotation bowler who throws the ball fairly straight. 2. low Track high rotation bowler who hooks the ball more than any other style but has major control issues.

I would suggest that you refine your release and get a consistent release before you go drilling a bunch of balls to fit a release that may or may not still be there in a year.

On the other hand if this is your only oppertunity to get a ball for yourself, then take your best guess and work on it when you get home, or look into lessons when you are here.

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#48179 - 01/23/08 08:12 AM Re: Low Track versus High Track? [Re: CoachJim]
Lefty Offline
Legend

Registered: 01/30/05
Posts: 2356
A/S/L: 37 / M / Rochester, NY
I'll try to explain what having a low Track does...

Think of your PAP as the center of a circle. That circle is your Track, and your Track is the path that rolls on the lane over the course of one revolution of the ball.

Now the closer your Track is to your thumb and finger holes, the farther it's going to be from your PAP, correct? And the father it is from your PAP, the larger the circle is going to be. And the larger the circle is, the more ball surface you'll have come in contact with the lane on each revolution of the ball. The more more ball surface you have come in contact with each revolution, the more friction you're going to have. The more friction, the more hook.

Now this doesn't mean that you want high Track though. There are a lot of low Track, high rev bowlers who are very successful. The high revs create more pin action and the lower Track can help the ball make a less violent reaction off the breakpoint.

Higher Track bowlers generally have to deal with the ball being jumpier off the breakpoint. There are other factors that go into it too.. there are people who spin the ball more that have the ball jump and there are higher Track bowlers who don't, but my experience is that in general, higher Track bowlers have the ball transition faster at the breakpoint.

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#48186 - 01/23/08 10:43 AM Re: Low Track versus High Track? [Re: Lefty]
Pattayabowler Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 189
A/S/L: 54/M/USA/THAILAND
What is it that makes one person a high Track bowler and the next person a low Track bowler? Fundamentally, is it the grip, the approach, the swing motion, the release or is it a combination of all of these factors that determines a low Track or high Track ball rotation?
_________________________
Legends - Conquerer (341 of 500) - Medium/Heavy to Heavy
Legends - Black Pearl - Medium to Medium/Heavy
Lane Masters - Sure Strike - Light to Medium
Hammer - Black Widow Pearl - Medium
Hammer - Emerald Vibe - Dry to Light
Ebonite - Maxim - Spare

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#48187 - 01/23/08 11:42 AM Re: Low Track versus High Track? [Re: Pattayabowler]
Lefty Offline
Legend

Registered: 01/30/05
Posts: 2356
A/S/L: 37 / M / Rochester, NY
I think it's more the release and the position your hand is in when your thumb comes out of the ball, and then what your hand does after that as well.

High Track bowlers tend to have their thumb stay in the ball longer and don't tend to wrap around the ball as much.


Edited by Lefty (01/23/08 11:42 AM)

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#48194 - 01/23/08 05:51 PM Re: Low Track versus High Track? [Re: Lefty]
CoachJim Offline
USBC Silver Coach

Registered: 09/19/06
Posts: 4665
A/S/L: Reston, Virginia USA
The low Track bowler's thumb is in the ball to the point where the thumb turns over the top of the ball.

The High Track bowler's thumb is out of the ball at a 12:00 position and the hand rotates the fingers around the side of the ball.

The bowler's Track is always close to 6 3/4" from the pap. Take Pattyabowler for instance his pap is 4 3/8" from his grip center, but the Track is at least 2" from the thumb which is close to 6 3/4" from pap to Track. A full roller's Track is 6 3/4" from grip center to pap and from pap to Track. That is why the max pin to pap distance is 6 3/4" most drillers don't feel comfortable drilling more than 6" from pap to pin.

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#48203 - 01/23/08 09:46 PM Re: Low Track versus High Track? [Re: CoachJim]
Pattayabowler Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 189
A/S/L: 54/M/USA/THAILAND
Several months ago, my Track was inside of an inch, closer to 1/2 inch of my thumbhole, however the way I was throwing the ball, swing and release, was causing pain in my left elbow (tendonitis). I think I was chicken winging my swing at the release in order to gain rev speed.

Anyway, now I am keeping my arm straight with a more free arm swing with more of a suitcase or handshake release, sometimes with a little wrist rotation at the release and I have found that my ball hooks much better now. I don't think my improved hook comes from the change from high Track to low Track; I think the chicken winging was causing me to come around the side of the ball too much instead of staying behind the ball.

My Pro Shop guy told me that I'm not keeping the ball on the palm of my hand during my swing and release. He said that I am throwing the ball using only my thumb and fingers in contact with the ball. He said that people that put a lot of hand into their ball typically develop a caluse on their palm below the index finger. Maybe my wrist is not stong enough to keep the ball in the palm or maybe my drilling layout is not correct for my span, I don't know.
_________________________
Legends - Conquerer (341 of 500) - Medium/Heavy to Heavy
Legends - Black Pearl - Medium to Medium/Heavy
Lane Masters - Sure Strike - Light to Medium
Hammer - Black Widow Pearl - Medium
Hammer - Emerald Vibe - Dry to Light
Ebonite - Maxim - Spare

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#48205 - 01/23/08 11:01 PM Re: Low Track versus High Track? [Re: CoachJim]
Lefty Offline
Legend

Registered: 01/30/05
Posts: 2356
A/S/L: 37 / M / Rochester, NY
Originally Posted By: CoachJim


The bowler's Track is always close to 6 3/4" from the pap. Take Pattyabowler for instance his pap is 4 3/8" from his grip center, but the Track is at least 2" from the thumb which is close to 6 3/4" from pap to Track. A full roller's Track is 6 3/4" from grip center to pap and from pap to Track.


In my head for some reason I keep thinking the PAP is on the same side of the ball as the Track, which is why I've always thought that a low Track also meant a small Track diamater.
[/quote]

Quote:

That is why the max pin to pap distance is 6 3/4" most drillers don't feel comfortable drilling more than 6" from pap to pin.


Doesn't a 6 3/4 pin to PAP give you no flare because the block is in a stable position, and more than that causes reverse flare?

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#48207 - 01/23/08 11:31 PM Re: Low Track versus High Track? [Re: Lefty]
Brian Longo Offline
Legend

Registered: 05/23/06
Posts: 1393
A/S/L: 37/M/Jacksonville, NC
Originally Posted By: Lefty
In my head for some reason I keep thinking the PAP is on the same side of the ball as the track, which is why I've always thought that a low track also meant a small track diamater.

That would be the NAP, or Negative Axis point.

Originally Posted By: Lefty
Doesn't a 6 3/4 pin to PAP give you no flare because the block is in a stable position, and more than that causes reverse flare?

Well, for the same reason you don't drill on the PAP you wouldn't drill 6 3/4" from the PAP because if you're not dead on with the measurement, you can cause a ball to go into reverse flare. It is true that a ball with a pin at 6 3/4" is in its most stable position, as it is true that a ball drilled with the pin on the PAP is also in its most stable position, but 1/2" to 3/4 from those spots will not make a world of difference to most bowlers.
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#63115 - 08/04/08 02:18 PM Re: Low Track versus High Track? [Re: Brian Longo]
RLD Offline
Action Bowler

Registered: 11/25/07
Posts: 210
A/S/L: Pinoy-Guamie on the Bay
Can you tell if someone has a low, medium, or high Track based on their PAP? If so, what are the parameters of each? ball

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