is this right???

Posted by: oppsimissedthat10pin

is this right??? - 03/22/09 06:41 PM

i bowled in the second round of the pepsi state tourney (placed 13th). there was a 17 year old one the pair next to me, he said he avered 160 and was getting 45 pins handicap per game, so he shoots 278,192,250,240,278,210 he got called a sandbagger by many people and took first in my divison 12 and up what do you think about this?
Posted by: Calvin Pistorio

Re: is this right??? - 03/22/09 06:52 PM

Were those scores scratch or with handicap? What average did you have to use a previous season's average or a current season's average?

It's not unknown for people to sandbag but sometimes people have a good day. Maybe he bowls in a tougher house and the shot you bowled on was much easier. It's kind of hard for us to say he bagged or not since we don't know the kid, where he bowls or anything about him.
Posted by: oppsimissedthat10pin

Re: is this right??? - 03/22/09 08:09 PM

scratch scores and this seasons average
Posted by: Lefont

Re: is this right??? - 03/22/09 08:34 PM

People sometimes lie about their current averages and if the organization folks are not pro-active about making sure they turn the correct averages, sometimes they can fall through the cracks and take advantage of it.

I've caught people lying before in tournaments and reported them.
Posted by: General Pounder

Re: is this right??? - 03/22/09 08:37 PM

Most people are not good enough to sandbag that big. Especially at 17. 160 may not be his actual average but he may have just had one of those days. I can see why people would say something. Averaging over 240 for 6 games and only having a 160 average.
Posted by: CoachJim

Re: is this right??? - 03/22/09 10:49 PM

The averages are based on last years book average, so the kid must have done his homework and practiced and got some coaching, good for him. Kids learn fast and can make large jumps in average in a short period of time with proper coaching and equipment.

Many of the kids I coach are doing the same thing.
Posted by: Atochabsh

Re: is this right??? - 03/23/09 12:22 AM

I agree with Jim....again.

When bowlers settle down and decide to really work on their game. They get private lessons, they practice, they keep their equipment in condition and they improve quickly. I improved 28 pins over an 8 week summer. That's with weekly lessons and nearly daily bowling. It happens not just with kids.

But the tournament should have a 10 pin rerate rule. If your current average is 10 pins or more you must rerate yourself. If it doesn't then its not the kid's fault he was able to take advantage of weak tournament rules.

Posted by: CoachJim

Re: is this right??? - 03/23/09 06:20 AM

I think it does have re-rate rules, but as of early november, so the kid may have been struggling with the new lessons and things clicked after. Also the lane conditions might be harder where he bowls, it's not like most houses put any kind of a shot down for the kids to bowl on, and they may have had a cake shot down for the tournament at least it was cake for him.
Posted by: 4StepShaun

Re: is this right??? - 03/23/09 07:16 AM

A 160 average bowler should not have a 700 in his life, not to mention two 720s in a row including 2 270 games. A fluke game here and there, sure, but not with that level of consistency.

It would not surprise me if he has a 'goof around' Saturday morning sanctioned league with that 160 average and he's averaging 220 bowling for his high school team.

Posted by: dmoney298

Re: is this right??? - 03/23/09 07:53 AM

All very valid points but I see this as more then just a good day. I average 190 and I cant put up scores like that.
Posted by: Matrix900

Re: is this right??? - 03/23/09 09:56 AM

When I see scores like that I usually goto and look up there name. Then I will look up to see if there home alley has a website. Just do a little research and see if any thing comes up. You might end up with assumptions but, It may lead you in a better direction than "he was sandbagging".

All you need is his name and be able to figure out what association he is in.

Its hard to tell without watching that person bowl if, He was a good bowler and sandbagging or just got lucky. Maybe even the house he bowls at is hard and the alleys the tournament used were in better shape as Coach mentioned.
Posted by: Calvin Pistorio

Re: is this right??? - 03/23/09 06:11 PM

The situation Jim and Erin described about getting coaching over a summer is the exact reason I ask those questions. If it's a previous season's average it would be easy to improve past that average in 7+months.