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#98015 - 07/14/09 01:32 PM Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes
Joe Bowler Offline
2x Virtual League Champion

Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 3824
A/S/L: 50s/M/MD
Some of what I have read here and recently experimented with has me re-thinking the best way to layout a ball for heavy oil and for dry lanes. First, let me qualify what I mean by heavy oil and dry lanes.

By heavy oil, I mean when the oil is heavy enough and/or long enough that you are forced to move your line inside because playing outside the ball refuses to hook back to the pocket and pointing the ball off the corner results in an inconsistent line to the pocket.

Conversely, by dry lanes, I mean extremely short oil or burned up heads where the ball seems to want to start hooking around the arrows, or even when it makes contact with the lane. And, moving inside only makes the problem worse because it seems the ball only hooks more. So, you are forced to play an extreme outside angle that would normally drop the ball in the gutter half way up the lane.

Conventional wisdom would suggest for this kind of heavy oil pin below the fingers, 3-3/8 from PAP, mass bias in a strong position, i.e., stacked leverage. The idea behind this would be to get the ball hooking and into a roll early.

Conventional wisdom would also suggest for this type of dry lanes pin above the fingers, 6-3/4 from PAP, mass bias in a weak position (either on the VAL (hook/set) or on the other side of the thumb (arc). The idea here would be to try to delay the ball from hooking.

HOWEVER, it seems these pin locations may not be the best for these extreme conditions. In the case of heavy oil, placing the pin above the fingers and further from the PAP (6-3/4) may actually help the ball conserve its energy for a stronger move at the breakpoint creating more pocket angle. And, in the case of dry lanes, placing the pin below the fingers and closer to the PAP (3-3/8) may help smooth the arc to the pocket so the ball is not so jumpy when it hits the dry.

Concerning the mass bias position, I think conventional wisdom still serves - strong position for heavy oil for more angular breakpoint shape, weak position for dry for a smoother arc.

What makes the most sense, assuming you are already using the appropriate ball, coverstock, surface prep, etc.? Does anybody have a favorite drilling for heavy oil and/or dry lanes that has worked for them that they would like to share?



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#98041 - 07/14/09 05:57 PM Re: Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes [Re: Joe Bowler]
muckypops Offline
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Registered: 06/01/09
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What???? How the heck did Fred Flintstone (my bowling hero) bowl so good? I know he didn't know all of this stuff...
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#98042 - 07/14/09 06:12 PM Re: Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes [Re: muckypops]
Joe Bowler Offline
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Registered: 04/09/09
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A/S/L: 50s/M/MD
For Freddy Boy, it was all in the toes. smile

By the way, my favorite thing to tell passengers that have never driven with me before: Hang on, I once saw this in a cartoon, but I think I can do it.
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#98047 - 07/14/09 06:37 PM Re: Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes [Re: muckypops]
J_w73 Offline
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Registered: 05/08/08
Posts: 1032
A/S/L: 37/M/Northern CA
long oil and heavy oil is completely different.. if you give me a complete flood that is 35 feet with clean backends, any ball you have will have enough time to hook on the backend.. I would say longer oil is more of a monster than heavy oil..I would think your statements may be true on longer oil like you described..
I have thought the same thing though. I always have trouble on heavy oil.. my heavy oil drilled balls (traditional closer to leverage pin to pap lower pin layouts, aggressive cover) still don't seem to move in heavy oil.. and if they do it is just way too early.. So that got me thinking the same way as you.. why not use a longer pin skid flippy ball that will hook as soon as it sees any dry. I'm looking to try my experiment on the shark pattern when we get to it in my pba league.. I have a ball that is just way too flippy for just about any condition..skoots in oil and as soon as it hits the dry it jumps a ton.. I'm gonna see what it does at super slow speed on the shark..



Edited by J_w73 (07/14/09 06:48 PM)
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#98049 - 07/14/09 07:35 PM Re: Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes [Re: J_w73]
Joe Bowler Offline
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Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 3824
A/S/L: 50s/M/MD
Agreed that longer heavy oil is more of a monster than shorter heavy oil. I will be interested in the results of your experiment with a skid/flip ball on the shark. Do you plan to sand it first, or are you thinking that may reduce the reaction on the backend?

I recently became a Visionary Test Staff member, and have 5 balls on the way. I plan to drill 3 of them to arc in varying degrees, but have been flip-flopping in my mind how to drill the heavy oil and dry lanes balls. One of the balls is particle, one is urethane, one solid reactive, one pearl reactive, and one classified as skid/flip pearl reactive. Mostly, I have been debating in my mind how to drill the particle for heavy oil, and the urethane for the dry. But, I have considered sanding the skid/flip pearl reactive and drilling that for heavy oil instead.

In my PBA Experience league, a guy has been killing the Shark with the latter drilling.
_________________________
USBC (2008-2016):
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House: 239
Sport: 210

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Internet advice is offered free, as is, at your own risk.

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#98059 - 07/14/09 09:25 PM Re: Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes [Re: Joe Bowler]
cgeorg Offline


Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 3567
A/S/L: Pittsburgh, Pa
I find it's best to match the VAL angle and core to the pattern length, and match the surface to the amount of oil. For short patterns, use larger VAL angle drillings so that the roll of the ball isn't fighting the pattern. For long patterns, short VAL distances so that the ball turns the corner quickly. Aggressive surfaces for heavier oil, and weaker surfaces for lighter oil.

Ex: Cheetah, start with a weaker dull ball with the pin under the ring finger. Dried up house shot, weaker shiny pearl with the pin under the ring finger.

Shark, strong dull ball with the pin up. Burned up Shark, strong pearl or hybrid with pin up.

When you get to something like the ToC, you need to create a hole, and then play that hole according to the length at which you bump it. It's a low volume pattern, so you actually need something that will clear the heads before it gets to the drier spot you've made. If you can burn up a spot to hook at 45 feet, play it like a low volume shark.

My $.02 based on slowly mounting experience.
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#98062 - 07/14/09 10:00 PM Re: Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes [Re: cgeorg]
Joe Bowler Offline
2x Virtual League Champion

Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 3824
A/S/L: 50s/M/MD
CG, I noticed the following ball in your arsenal on BowlSK (BTW, nice website!)

Roto-Grip - Cell
Drilling: 20 x 5 1/2" x 70
Surface: 1000
Strong ball with a weaker drilling. I really like this one on longer patterns. It helps you stay outside, picking up a really heavy roll and reacting very evenly to the dry. A very controllable drilling, this one does just what my hand tells it to, no more.

How does this fit in with what you are saying? Or am I reading the degrees backwards? Is there a different ball in your arsenal you would use on the Shark pattern?
_________________________
USBC (2008-2016):
300s: 9
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House: 239
Sport: 210

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Spares: WD

Internet advice is offered free, as is, at your own risk.

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#98066 - 07/14/09 10:43 PM Re: Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes [Re: Joe Bowler]
cgeorg Offline


Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 3567
A/S/L: Pittsburgh, Pa
I don't have a strong ball with a high pin... My Total is almost as strong as the Cell, has a higher pin. It is the ball I usually use to start on a fresh Shark pattern. As that starts to enter the pocket poorly, I go to my dying Big One. With the Cell I can get outside with on longer stuff, but it labors if I try to move in. It works best outside after the lanes have broken down a bit, so the pattern isn't playing as long - I can get my speed up and stay behind it, playing up the boards, or close to it. It also works fairly well when moving inside on medium length patterns (40ish feet) where other balls are struggling to turn the corner properly - I think the length of the pin to PAP provides me with the little extra help getting it down lane, while the strength of the core and surface ensures that it gets back to the pocket with enough entry angle.
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#98081 - 07/15/09 04:03 AM Re: Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes [Re: Joe Bowler]
J_w73 Offline
Legend

Registered: 05/08/08
Posts: 1032
A/S/L: 37/M/Northern CA
Originally Posted By: Joe Bowler
Agreed that longer heavy oil is more of a monster than shorter heavy oil. I will be interested in the results of your experiment with a skid/flip ball on the shark. Do you plan to sand it first, or are you thinking that may reduce the reaction on the backend?

I recently became a Visionary Test Staff member, and have 5 balls on the way. I plan to drill 3 of them to arc in varying degrees, but have been flip-flopping in my mind how to drill the heavy oil and dry lanes balls. One of the balls is particle, one is urethane, one solid reactive, one pearl reactive, and one classified as skid/flip pearl reactive. Mostly, I have been debating in my mind how to drill the particle for heavy oil, and the urethane for the dry. But, I have considered sanding the skid/flip pearl reactive and drilling that for heavy oil instead.

In my PBA Experience league, a guy has been killing the Shark with the latter drilling.


I was thinking about sanding also... but I think the sanding may smooth out the hook too much and defeat the test.. if the volume is high enough to the point where sanding the ball won't cause it to hook early at all then I may try it.. first week I'm going out of box.. if it doesn't seem to work I'll try sanded the next week..
I'll make sure to post what happens.

The ball I am actually going to try is a visionary green gargoyle.. I have it drilled with a 5" pin to pap with the pin way up near the VAL.. the ball is the most angular and flippy ball I have seen.. the heavier the oil in front and the snappier it is as long is there is some dry...even on really dry lanes the ball will get down the lane and still be angular...
the ball hates carry down so even if it works it may only work for half a game.. I really think the key is going to be the super slow speed to give it enough time to react on the backend.. even with fresh oil..
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#98861 - 07/23/09 05:35 AM Re: Best Layouts for Oil and Dry Lanes [Re: J_w73]
J_w73 Offline
Legend

Registered: 05/08/08
Posts: 1032
A/S/L: 37/M/Northern CA
We bowled on the Shark in my pba league. I used my green gargoyle. The ball is definately not for oil and the way it is drilled is super super flippy on a normal condition. The ball actually work very well on the shark. I had to slow the ball down but that wasn't a problem as the ball would skate on the oil up front. When it got to the backend it had a nice flip and got to the pocket and hit great.. I think I only had two pocket shots that didn't carry.. a 7 and a 10 pin.
Shot a clean 240 game, a 7 strike/ 0 spare 212 game, a 182 with , and a 179. The games 3 and 4 were just me .. the ball worked well all night long. I just moved about 3 boards left with my feet by the 4th game using the same break point..
In practice I tried my sanded rico'd mammoth and the ball just wanted to move a little early but had no sort of angle on the back end to carry.
_________________________
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Book Average 220

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