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#96953 - 07/02/09 01:08 AM Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions
beefers1 Offline
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Registered: 02/04/09
Posts: 962
A/S/L: 17/M/Vancouver, BC
Hi all. I finally found some time, took advantage of the $1 a game deal today (Canada Day), and went practicing for the first time in nearly 2 months. The first thing I worked on was a free swing. With it, I was able to get my backswing MUCH higher, thus vastly improving ball speed. I was also able to throw much straighter and more accurately on spares with that style (finally picked up several left-handed 3-5-6-9 buckets and 3-5-6's by throwing straight down 25; I found that to be more effective than hooking). Considering I was a bit rusty, consistency improved quite a bit too. OK, now here are my questions:

I found that my rev rate is significantly reduced with the high backswing. Any idea why this is so? I mean, I know that more hook does not make you better, but I do know that too little hook will get you a lot of flat leaves (like those buckets I left) and washouts. So how can I fix this problem? I'm trying to cup my wrist, but it's just not as it used to be.

With a free swing, how do I control my ball speed? One way to compensate for my lower revs would be to slow the ball down, but it seems kinda hard unless I muscle the ball at 10mph, like I used to, again.

When I'm shooting spares, the ball seems to bounce twice right when I release it. Sorry, but I'm currently unable to make videos as I am without a working cameras. Possible reasons?

Thanks for reading, and any feedback is appreciated.
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#96954 - 07/02/09 01:14 AM Re: Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions [Re: beefers1]
Dennis Michael Offline
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How are you coming out of the ball? If you have too much side rotation, you will kill the revs. Sometimes a higher back swing is accompanied with your hand turning. (Hand on the side of the ball) Stay behind the ball.
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#96956 - 07/02/09 01:36 AM Re: Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions [Re: Dennis Michael]
beefers1 Offline
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Registered: 02/04/09
Posts: 962
A/S/L: 17/M/Vancouver, BC
Sorry if I didn't understand correctly, but isn't side rotation what makes a ball hook?

Anyway, my wrist is fully uncupped at the top of the backswing. Is that a problem?
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#96957 - 07/02/09 02:30 AM Re: Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions [Re: beefers1]
Jay R. Offline
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Registered: 05/03/08
Posts: 1204
A/S/L: 21/M/Tacoma, WA
"Anyway, my wrist is fully uncupped at the top of the backswing. Is that a problem?"

I don't think so, not on its own anyways. What I try to do is get my wrist in a stronger position as the ball descends from the zero gravity point(top) of the swing. That's when it takes the least amount of effort since gravity is working with me. At least I think that's the case. I simply don't have the wrist strength to keep a firm wrist during all parts of the swing unless I muscle the swing a lot, so what I just described is my only chance at any type of good wrist position.

With the higher backswing, do you feel like you're losing the ball early? That could also be a factor in loss of revs. Maybe you could use more forward pitch in the thumb to accomodate for this change. This could be connected to your double dribble on your spares if you're changing your release especially by breaking your wrist. I'm not really sure though.

For speed, common suggestion when using a free swing is to raise the ball in your stance to increase speed and lower the ball in your stance to decrease it. Try these things and see what happens, I've heard the opposite can be true as well especially if your swing isn't truly free.

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#96958 - 07/02/09 03:30 AM Re: Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions [Re: Jay R.]
beefers1 Offline
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Registered: 02/04/09
Posts: 962
A/S/L: 17/M/Vancouver, BC
Thanks, Amateur. What do I need to get some forward pitch into the thumb hole? Will the Pro Shop guy have to plug and re-drill completely?

I don't feel as if I'm losing the ball early. In fact, sometimes when I try to hook a bit more I let go too late, pulling the ball. For spares I'm rolling end-over-end (not completely over the holes, but definitely rolling forward and not sideways), will thumb pitch help?
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#96959 - 07/02/09 03:39 AM Re: Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions [Re: beefers1]
whiz Offline
Junior Coach

Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 43
A/S/L: 24/M/OK
Originally Posted By: beefers1
Sorry if I didn't understand correctly, but isn't side rotation what makes a ball hook?


If you work the inside of the ball ...you can go more or less up the back of the ball and still create alot of hook. I usually never go past 45 degrees and lots of times if i cant control that I try throwing it end over end with even less axis rotation...


Originally Posted By: beefers1
Anyway, my wrist is fully uncupped at the top of the backswing. Is that a problem?


No its not. I wait until the top of the swing and then cup/and or firm my wrist during the forward swing. what you do at the start of the forwardswing is more important. Lots of people thay really rev the ball open their hands alot at the top of thier backswing if you pay attention...

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#96960 - 07/02/09 03:45 AM Re: Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions [Re: beefers1]
whiz Offline
Junior Coach

Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 43
A/S/L: 24/M/OK
Originally Posted By: beefers1


I found that my rev rate is significantly reduced with the high backswing. Any idea why this is so? I mean, I know that more hook does not make you better, but I do know that too little hook will get you a lot of flat leaves (like those buckets I left) and washouts. So how can I fix this problem? I'm trying to cup my wrist, but it's just not as it used to be.



you know what one day i played with "pulling" the ball up to create a higher backswing and i had the exact same problem. my coach told me i was prolly not getting my hand under or behind the ball as much as i usually do. you may also be giving yourself less time to get your thumb out depending on how much faster you swing is...

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#96963 - 07/02/09 06:27 AM Re: Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions [Re: beefers1]
CoachJim Offline
USBC Silver Coach

Registered: 09/19/06
Posts: 3490
A/S/L: Reston, Virginia USA
Quote:
When I'm shooting spares, the ball seems to bounce twice right when I release it. Sorry, but I'm currently unable to make videos as I am without a working camera. Possible reasons?


Try charging the battery laugh

There are several reasons for bouncing the ball, the main reason is the ball is going down at an angle into the lane instead of the ball hanging on the hand into the release zone (the area from 6" behind your foot to 6" in front of your foot).

What might cause the ball to fall off your hand, or head down into the approach instead of landing like an airplane?

1. Too much bending at the waist will cause the ball to head down into the lane. Keeping your shoulders behind your knees and your chest pointing at the target at the break point and bending from the knees instead will help this.

2. The ball is falling off your thumb because of improper fit:
a. Too much reverse pitch
b. Hole too big
c. Too much bevel causes ball to slip off too soon.
d. all of the above

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#96968 - 07/02/09 07:11 AM Re: Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions [Re: CoachJim]
Lefty Offline
Legend

Registered: 01/30/05
Posts: 2350
A/S/L: 37 / M / Rochester, NY
I agree with CoachJim. If you're not generating many revolutions and you're bouncing the ball, something, or everything on his list is most likely the culprit.

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#96971 - 07/02/09 07:29 AM Re: Tried Free Swing, Have Some Questions [Re: Lefty]
cgeorg Online   content
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Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 3398
A/S/L: Pittsburgh, Pa
Good stuff from Jim.

re: slowing it down, start the ball lower before the pushaway. Smaller swing in the front + free = smaller swing in the back.
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