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Registered: 27/08/04
Posts: 10136
Loc: Mountain View, CA
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#65821 - 09/05/08 06:59 PM
Re: Plastic Ball Tourney
[Re: howiegroove]
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Legend
Registered: 05/23/06
Posts: 1275
A/S/L: 34/M/Hampstead, NC
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revs dont mean as much on plastic balls. they go straight. WRW has played the same line with plastic balls before reactive was even available. I beg to differ. Revs mean more for plastic than today's reactives/particles because the core/cover combination for plastic balls are not very powerful, so revs are the X-factor. 15-20 years ago when I was a junior bowler, the guys who could rev the ball with the "less powerful" (compared to today's equipment) urethane and plastic balls were the ones scoring - depending on their accuracy. Look at what Mark Roth did to the sport in the late 70's and early 80's and look at the pocket Pete Weber used to make with his shot compared to the "strokers" of the day. I can agree and know all too well that accuracy makes all the difference, but when we're talking about professionals here, there's not a big difference between "most accurate and least accurate", however, there is a big difference between high rev and low rev. FWIW, during the urethane years when Walter Ray was a relative newcomer to the tour, he was pretty much ineffective (6 titles from 1981 to 1992), but upon the advent of "the resin age", that's when he really became a force (38 titles from 1993-present). I'm not saying his success was all because of resin equipment, but the equipment was certainly better for his game and he adapted well to it. Pete Weber struggled to get used to resin for a time, but since he has adapted and he's been moderately effective post-urethane (19 titles before 1993, 15 since 1993).
_________________________
Brian Longo 25+ years bowling, 8 years "behind the counter" as a mechanic, "laneman" and in the pro shop --"Even the expert was once a beginner"-- --"There are no magical balls, just magical bowlers"--
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#65826 - 09/05/08 08:32 PM
Re: Plastic Ball Tourney
[Re: Brian Longo]
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Legend
Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 1885
A/S/L: 27/m/maryland
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If plastic goes straight how come I've used mine and covered 20+ boards with it on occasion? Its all about the condition, and rev rate plus surface prep. You can dull a plastic ball and get a bit more grip out of it and with a lot of revs like Robert Smith, TJ, Jason Couch and so on especially on a dry enough condition of or if they slow the speed down some.
_________________________
Calvin's Highs Career HG:300 HS:763 2008-2009 Winter Season HG:277 HS:673
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#65835 - 09/05/08 11:11 PM
Re: Plastic Ball Tourney
[Re: infernocal]
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Legend
Registered: 07/10/03
Posts: 1199
A/S/L: 40/M/NYC
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I'm with Brian. I would go with Pete, because he combines high revs with accuracy. Walter is very accurate but gets help from the resin reactive bowling balls. He would begin to leave weak 10 pins again. The accurate high rev bowlers will probably dominate.
_________________________
bowl to win baby!
Deuce - #16 - Matte Pyro - heavy #15 - particle pearl T-Road Pearl - #16 - High flare/High differential pearl Too Hot - #16 - Low flare/Low differential pearl
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#65838 - 09/06/08 12:11 AM
Re: Plastic Ball Tourney
[Re: Smooth Stroker]
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Bracket Donor
Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 130
A/S/L: 17/M/CA
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http://www.bowl.com/articleView.aspx?i=14828&f=7the last two videos (toward the bottom), show WRW striking with his plastic ball presumably on the short pattern. I'd take my bets on him.
_________________________
Roto-Grip Venus - 15LB - Light Oil - Medium Dry Dynothane Vendetta - 15LB - Medium - Medium Heavy Lane Masters Big Bang - 15LB - Medium - Heavy Lane Masters Terminator - 15LB - Medium - Heavy Ebonite Infinite One - 15LB - Medium Heavy - Heavy
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#65842 - 09/06/08 12:33 AM
Re: Plastic Ball Tourney
[Re: Rickywin]
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Legend
Registered: 05/23/06
Posts: 1275
A/S/L: 34/M/Hampstead, NC
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I'm sure the lanes that WRW was bowling on were dry enough for him to be using that ball, and he is one of the more versatile bowlers on tour, for sure. Nobody said he can't compete with a plastic ball - he is the most prolific winner in tour history for a reason - but the odds favor the bowler who has revs and WRW isn't exactly in the class of Tommy Jones, Robert Smith or Jason Couch. The margin of error with a plastic ball is much smaller than a resin ball, and revs increase that margin of error. Shoot, I don't profess to be pro material, but I have a chance of walking into an event, winning the qualifier and winning the tournament as well as the next guy. The problem is my odds are slim.  Same scenario with a stroker/tweener using plastic against a high rev bowler; no doubt they could win, but the odds favor the bowler with hand. I never count out WRW for any event, but you have to believe he has to be near perfect in an event such as this.
_________________________
Brian Longo 25+ years bowling, 8 years "behind the counter" as a mechanic, "laneman" and in the pro shop --"Even the expert was once a beginner"-- --"There are no magical balls, just magical bowlers"--
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#65850 - 09/06/08 07:09 AM
Re: Plastic Ball Tourney
[Re: Rickywin]
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Legend
Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 1885
A/S/L: 27/m/maryland
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I think Pete will be the best bet, maybe Barnes or someone with a similar style could challenge since they have a decent amount of revs and usually good accuracy.
_________________________
Calvin's Highs Career HG:300 HS:763 2008-2009 Winter Season HG:277 HS:673
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#65851 - 09/06/08 08:14 AM
Re: Plastic Ball Tourney
[Re: Brian Longo]
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Legend
Registered: 01/30/05
Posts: 1796
A/S/L: 36 / M / Rochester, NY
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I beg to differ. Revs mean more for plastic than today's reactives/particles because the core/cover combination for plastic balls are not very powerful, so revs are the X-factor. 15-20 years ago when I was a junior bowler, the guys who could rev the ball with the "less powerful" (compared to today's equipment) urethane and plastic balls were the ones scoring - depending on their accuracy. Look at what Mark Roth did to the sport in the late 70's and early 80's and look at the pocket Pete Weber used to make with his shot compared to the "strokers" of the day. I can agree and know all too well that accuracy makes all the difference, but when we're talking about professionals here, there's not a big difference between "most accurate and least accurate", however, there is a big difference between high rev and low rev.
FWIW, during the urethane years when Walter Ray was a relative newcomer to the tour, he was pretty much ineffective (6 titles from 1981 to 1992), but upon the advent of "the resin age", that's when he really became a force (38 titles from 1993-present). I'm not saying his success was all because of resin equipment, but the equipment was certainly better for his game and he adapted well to it. Pete Weber struggled to get used to resin for a time, but since he has adapted and he's been moderately effective post-urethane (19 titles before 1993, 15 since 1993). Exactly. Lower rev players are the ones who benefited the most from todays bowling balls. Revs are absolutely more important with plastic and urethane.
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#65872 - 09/06/08 03:44 PM
Re: Plastic Ball Tourney
[Re: Lefty]
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Legend
Registered: 03/28/06
Posts: 1249
A/S/L: 33/M/Tinley Park, IL
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Resin has helped a lot of low rev bowlers become better bowlers. I have a buddy of mine from college who was a good bowler when he joined the team. He was throwing a yellow dot. He would get a few strikes and pick all of his spares. At his first tourney, he was killing the pocket and leaving 10 pin after 4 pin after 10 pin. One of the guys picked up his ball and put his hand in it. It fit. He went to his bag and grabbed a T-Shark (old Track resin ball). He told Mark: Use this, move here, aim there. He had the next 7. Resin made him a great bowler. Before, he would have the occasional 220 game but was always around 190. After he was averaging almost 220.
_________________________
================================== HG: 300 HS: 826 Cell, Special Agent, Paradigm, X-Factor, Erase-IT, Spare Storm (black)
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#70520 - 11/12/08 08:41 AM
Re: Plastic Ball Tourney
[Re: howiegroove]
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Bumper Bowler
Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 2
A/S/L: 30/male/atlanta, ga, usa
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I think a high rev guy will take it. I don't think WRW or Duke will be able to carry the corner pins.
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