hi guys,
i was hoping some knowledge drillers would post here. i plan to go to a Pro Shop to get this fixed but i'm nervous that most of the drillers in my area don't know what they're doing. i just want some opinions before i get the same ball redrilled for the 4th time!

here's the deal: i used to have a thumb squeezing problem and couldn't get outta the ball. the driller put more reverse pitch in the ball so i could. it worked for awhile until i discovered how to relax my thumb. now i realize that i think the ball has either a span problem and/or a severe problem of to much reverse thumb pitch.

i feel the ball is either to loose and drops or it's to tight and won't come off my hand. if i add tape or my hand is sweaty, it sticks. if i take the tape out, i drop the ball. it always rubs at the bevel if it does stick. the ball also comes off my thumb about 1/2" during the swing and locks onto the knuckle. it just doesn't feel right.

here are some pics:

the way it fits when i just put my hand in it:



the way it sits on my hand as soon as it's put into swing:



another illustration of how far it comes off the thumb:



here is my span:





i'm not an expert in drilling yet but i know what my hand feels and it feels as though i should have forward pitch (either 0 or 1/8" maybe) and some more reverse pitch in the fingers.

btw, my span is right at 4" from tip of thumb to tip of fingergrip and my reverse pitch is 3/8 or more (not sure how much he added last drilling). i believe i have a little bit reverse finger pitch but i can't be positive on that one.


PLEASE HELP! ANY COMMENTS WELCOME!

Looks as if the span, thumb hole size and pitch are not correct. Try and find an IBPSIA certified shop, even if you have to go to another town.
Okotte

i know of a couple drillers round here. the one i know has had the classes that Ebonite offers. not sure if that's certification or not.

how do u know okorimbo my span and thumb pitch is off? should i have a longer span with more forward pitch?

No, you need shorter span with more forward pitch in the thumb.

We know the pitch needs to go forward because one of the drillers put more reverse because you were gripping the ball and he knew that was the only way you could get out of it without "hurting" yourself.

The span is long, if you look at the picture where your fingers are just laying over the ball, the leading edge of the insert should be half way between the two knuckles, yours looks only a quarter of the way from the knuckle closest to the nail. Also in the other pictures you can see the hand is stretched some in order to get the thumb in the ball.

Go to the shop where the guy has been to the Ebonite training, Jeff Userey runs it and is one of the best drillers in bowling. I would feel confident in anyone that has been trained by him or the staff at Ebonite.

Your span is way too long. Who ever drilled that doesn't know what he/she is doing. You can tell if your span is correct by placing your thumb in the ball and laying your fingers across the holes. The leading edge (side closest to the thumb) of the finger hole should be no longer than half way between the first and second knuckle of the middle and ring finger without stretching your hand, it should be relaxed. It can be a little shorter than that, but not shorter than one quarter from the second knuckle.

If you already have a ball you can tell if your span is right by putting your hand in the ball and see if the fingernails are pressing the back of the holes, a properly fit ball will not have the fingers pressing into the back of the hole.

On my balls I can put my thumb in first and still be able to put my fingers in the ball, I don’t advocate doing this, but it is a good test to see if your span is too long.

Your thumb hole is way too big, I can see 1/2 of the hole with your thumb in it. This usually happens because you are bending the knuckle to hang onto the ball. If you put your thumb in the ball, it should be fairly tight with your thumb straight (it can be a touch lose to allow for tape/magic carpet).

At 4" span you should be at 1/4" forward to start out with, then keep going forward until your thumb catches slightly, then back off 1/16". I recommend going forward 1/4" at a time to save on drillings. Just make sure it is not you squeezing the ball before you give up on a thumb pitch and back off. Once you get the feel of allowing your thumb to relax in the hole you will be able to tell when you squeeze the ball or not.

Word of warning, you will throw the ball through the ceiling if you go to forward pitch and still bend the thumb, so let the ball fall off your hand or you will risk injuring yourself.

Picture to go along with what they've described


You also have a tremendous amount of bevel.

yeah, i've gone to the guy with Ebonite training and he's the one that put that much negative pitch in my hand. but i think he did it so i wouldn't put it through the roof like u said.

as for the span: if i put thumb in first then the fingers i can't quite get the fingers in all the way down to the crease. i guess just another verification that it's stretched.

do you guys recommend i slowly increase my forward pitch until i get used to it or just make the dive and go 1/4" forward?

thanks for all the help so far guys!

Most people put their fingers in first then their thumb. I don't think putting your thumb in first is a good indication of a poor fit. I know my fit is right. If I put my thumb in first and then attempt to put in my finger tips (as if for bowling), it just don't work. The only time we ask people to put their thumb in first is to lay their fingers across the finger holes as has been illustrated in several photos here. Not to actually grip the ball for actual bowling.

I'm not saying you did not get a poor fit to start, but you did mention that you used to squeeze and that the driller adjusted the pitch for your squeezing. Well it stands to reason that if you change your grip (squeezing) and delivery that you'd have to change your drill too. I think given the information at the time, the driller probably did the best they could for a first time drill.

Drilling is an imperfect science and drillers only have what they see to go on, plus the feedback from the bowler. If that feedback changes or the bowler changes then that makes a big difference in how you drill the ball. Say you had gone in there and it was drilled for a relaxed non squeezing grip. You'd have probably stuck in the ball or did stick in the ball. Then the bowler goes back to the shop and says..."Hey, my thumb hole is too small". Driller responds "you are gripping the ball, don't over grip the ball". Bowler goes back out tries again, still sticks, returns to the shop "its still sticking". So at that point the driller adjusts the thumb hole so that the bowler can get out of the ball, proper or not.

I suggest that you go back to the driller, tell him that you've learned to not overgrip the ball and now the thumb hole feels too lose and the span too long. At that point you may have to short plug the thumb and redrill it. If that doesn't solve the problem then a full plug of the thumb and adjusting it for pitch and span. Or you can just full plug the thumb overnight and skip one step.

Erin

That Quote is what I suggested for Yonkinator to do, not actually bowl like that. If you put your thumb in first and then point your fingers to the ball so they go straight down and there is no holes there, then the span is too long. If the holes are in the vacinity then the fit is not too far off. I have seen people do this and the holes are not within inches.

So what is the most common finger pitch: 3/8"? If you use power lifts, how much more forward pitch would be needed to compensate?