in resopnse to Atochabsh, i had exactly that problem myself last season. averaged 203 on my junior league with the house shot, but could never find a groove in any tournament (and i competed in 10-12 tournaments last season, found a niche during ONE of them, which surprisingly was the only regional tournament i did during the year, the rest were local or state-only, not to mention the tragedy at nationals last year), but as i said, i know exactly what you are talking about here.

I knew a guy who left significantly less than one open per game and still averaged under 200. Even for me, one open per game would only put my average at around 220.

Then, think of all the 200-210 players currently averaging under 170 on the PBA patterns...and the pros, even a cranker like Robert Smith will hit over 90% of his single-pin spares...



Anyway, 180fury, if you're averaging 170 in house conditions, you could probably stand to improve in literally every aspect of the game. That was certainly true of me when I was at 170, and my arsenal at the time consisted of a plain urethane ball, a plain plastic ball and a $20 pair of shoes.

In addition to Erin's excellent advice, I'll mention that, if the Complete NV doesn't hook for you, you need to get more hand in the ball. Even as a pure stroker, you have to be doing at least one thing that's preventing the ball from rotating as it leaves your hand.

If you can get somebody to take a video of you, do that, and just look at it yourself with a critical eye. You'll start to see things you'll want to change with the first viewing.

Excuse me???? Try that when you are 45 and let just take some testosterone from you too. Make you a 45 year old woman and see if you can compete at the 200+ level. You are a kid. A power hungry newbie that has all the wrist and hand to overpower house conditions.

Its not a professional level and if you were older you'd know that. How many times do you get a messenger fly across the deck and take out your less then perfect shots? How many times do you go Brooklyn? Because I go Brooklyn maybe twice a month. If its a bad month, maybe 4 times.

And by the way....most nights, I don't leave any splits! I just don't miss by that much. And I rarely miss spares....any spares.

Its actually not all your fault. You are young and have no idea of how your phsyical abilities will be compromised in nearly 30 years. But it is a good idea to listen to what people that have been around the block a few times have to say before spouting out about how many spares you can miss and STILL average 214. Just to let you know.....that's not really something to brag about.

For you, I would suggest that you attend a Senior PBA tour stop. And see how folks that have been doing this for a very long time, stay competative and accurate.

Erin

That comment really bothered me too. The fact is, make spares and you are over 200. String a few strikes, and you will be higher. But, don't rely on strings of strikes to get you over 200. If you do, something is wrong with your game. Fix it, or you will stay there.

Too many people are enamored by their first ball and forget about the second ball. If we only rolled 1 ball we would all be really good. But, that's not the case. And, if you leave more than 1 split per set, you also have something wrong with your game.

At 170, It's rarely the ball that caused the trouble, it's usually the bowler.

That's exactly where I am. I average 6 strikes per game and 2 opens. That sucks.
The strikes are not getting me to 200+. The missed spares are keeping me from 220. I know I need some help, and get it. How can you not see it?

230 is the new 200.

Dennis, you *do* need strikes to get to 200, or even above 190. If you 9/ everything, an 9 on the fill shot, you'll end up at a 190. Dutch 200 - the most strikes you can have without stringing any. You need strings of strikes just to break 200, plain and simple.

Mathematically, you are right. The issue is for every open, you need a double to make it up, not just a strike. If you are capable of that, then the open held you down.

If I get 6 strikes per game and 2 opens, 2 doubles were wasted.

humm i avg 170 because i suck right now. i have a new coach as of today so i can fix these things that know more about now. i never said a ball will get me a 300. also i didnt put the things about splits or spares. i miss spares, splits, pins, i gutter too. i also only bowl 1 day out of the week most of the time and i have a job that takes up my time and i dont get to go bowling as much as other folks. also have a 2 year old girl. you dont get to do anything when all you do is work, eat, sleep, and have kids. just remember i never said i was good or that a ball would save me. but i found a ball that has helped a little and thats my Track. so its all cool now. i have a good Pro Shop guy and hopefully a good coach too. usbc certified. i'll send ya card if ya want one and that nv is junk. it was drilled wrong and i had it proven by the guy at the shop i go to now. my new stuff is drilled right and does what its suppose to. so i got a new ball and i;m good now. also--->

<---also this is not me btw--->!!! -->Originally Posted By: Satyuros
More of a reference to actobash, but one split a night and only a couple opens..? Um, you're talking nearly professional level there... If you're only leaving one split a night, you've got horse shoes rammed up your [censored]. I left 3 splits in one game tonight, and I still averaged 214 for 3 games.

humm not me...

don't mean to dig up an old post here, but something about this statement sort of bothered me a little bit. you said that you left 3 splits in one game, and you averaged 214 for the three games. while that's well and good and all, there are a few things to take into account here: 1) how many of those splits did you convert? 2) in what place were those splits in relation to strikes that were strung together? 3) what was your variance between the high and low games? 3 splits in one game, if placed in the worst possible places (which i would consider to be the third, sixth and either the ninth or tenth frames), even with only strikes strung together between them could only net you a maximum of 198
(i.e. X X 81 X X 81 X X X 81,
or X X 81 X X 81 X X 81 XXX)
on the other hand, if you grouped them together, say, in the first three frames, you could max out at a 237
(i.e. 81 81 81 X X X X X X XXX)
and that is assuming that all of your splits were two pin splits and you did not convert any of them.

Of course, there are many different levels of thought here, none of which i wish to divulge in more because it would take too much room in this post, but i believe in saying that one split and a couple of opens in one night is not required to keep an average above 200 is not an available option to your average Joe Bowler. Consistency is the key in most sports, and bowling isn't really an exception. sure, there may be some league nights where the pattern allows for a 6-10 board area for your mark, but there are others where you only get one or two boards. i, for one, am siding with erin here; i find myself, even at around the same age as you, that i wouldn't be able to keep a high scoring pace up without at least making most of my spares on any given night.

My thought on opens is that on a house shot, you should strive to average 1 or less open frame a night, and that includes missed splits.

I just checked my stats for my house shot league and I have 27 games and 28 open frames.