Untutored, you are a no thumber and a full roller?

1. The trail leg should be used for guiding your upper body like a rudder, try to feel like the trail leg is an extension of the target line and it will keep your shoulders square to the target line.

2. End over end shot instead of working on that since you have a full roller Track the ball is probably rolling mostly end over end as it is, try to work the inside of the ball with your fingers, meaning keep your elbow on the inside of the ball through the release, then snap your wrist and elbow straight through the target, you will probably move your Track away from the full roller area if you do it properly.

3. the liberator is made for playing straighter up the outside for normal bowlers, there is no limit to what a no thumb bowler can do with it, so watch the reaction and move left if it hooks too much and right if it doesn't hook enough.

4. You are probably limited as far as playing the twig goes, that is why there aren't many no thumbers on the PBA tour, because most of the patterns are played to the right of the 3rd arrow and the no thumber's comfort area is from the third arrow to the inside.

5. As far as adjustments go, experiment with finger pressure and different pressure on different fingers. You will find that if you press harder on the ring finger your hand will not turn around the ball as much as putting pressure on the index finger. You will have to experiment and figure things out for yourself.

I know there is a page 8. So, why doesn't it come up?

Recent Posts says CoachJim was the last to post this am. Yet, untutored post is the last to show. Another bug?????

Good, I post, and it shows up. Go figure.

It did this to one of cg's posts I asked him what it was and he could go back and see it, but when brandon510 and I went to look at it we couldn't see it, then after someone else posted it showed up.

Your post must have been hanging on the edge of page 7, and didn't carry enough weight to create a new page.

Too bad. You carry weight in my book. In importance, I mean.

Great more fat jokes, sure go ahead, make fun of the fat kid he doesn't have any feelings.

Yeah. At the time, it felt like a natural evolution, but it seems nobody else does it this way.

My shoulder opens fully when I pull the ball back, and my arm's bent inward with the elbow locked so I'm directly behind the ball at the end of the backswing. Halfway through the foreswing, my shoulder disengages so my arm can follow the ball, and my wrist breaks so my hand remains fully (but now diagonally) behind the ball. Then, the muscles re-engage and I follow through with a short uppercut, my fist finishing (slightly) in front of and next to my ear, with the first knuckle of the index finger at 4 o'clock.

I haven't had any joint pain in my arm for a long time--even when I overdo, all I get is a little muscle soreness. My legs are another story...


Anyway, it turns out I'm giving the ball a full roll, but it's turning on a fairly wide axis when it comes out.

If that's the point of the trail leg, I should go back to not having a kick--that's basically what that leg was doing before. I was expecting the leg would act as a counterbalance, allowing me to get my body a bit lower.

Since my shoulders are closed on the end-over-end shot, I'll try kicking to 6:00 or 6:15, see whether that helps.


I'll try it that way. (I've been trying to keep everything straight.)

I'm down to about 10 degrees axis tilt with a closed shoulder, but I'm still hoping to get to 0.

I was hoping it would give me a consistent 3-5 boards over the Groove Urethane, but it's turned out to be more temperamental than that. Full speed down the outside, it's only giving me one extra board, but if I throw it slow enough, it will give me five extra boards across the middle.

Moving my target an extra board or two right (i.e. stand at 28, aim for 12 instead of 13) seems to help it stay in the pocket, on the house shot at least.


Anyway, my next ball I'll try to get a composite surface with a pancake block, see how that works.

My impression was that thumbless bowlers break down physically bowling 50 games in a week. That's what happened to Mike Miller, anyway.

(One advantage for a two-handed bowler like Belmonte is that his left arm and right leg are doing more of the work, so it's easier for him to stay healthy. Even so, Belmonte hasn't tried the PBA schedule yet.)


As for me, I can already bowl up the fifth board safely enough; I've never tried outside of there. I'm planning to turn my body inward like Jowdy recommends and not worry too much about the consequences, and just see how many gutters I throw going up 3 or 2.

I'll try that, thanks.

Oh, and thanks for your time, coach.

It does this to me too.

Sometimes, I can click on the 'recent posts' to the right and get the new post, even when I can't get it to show up going through the forum menu.

More bugs to be squashed, maybe we can get some of the spiders to capture and kill the bugs. If you've read the Technical topic Dennis started a few days ago that will make sense.

Now on to more bowling related stuff. I got my Liberator back today . It sure did feel good on my hand, they set me up with a lane to give it a try. It slipped slightly on the thumb but a couple pieces of black tape on the back of the thumb helped that a lot. It helped the thumb lock in better with out much gripping. I needed to get some white tape and I think a piece or two of that will go a long way to allow the ball to just stay on my hand by itself. I now have some and next time out will have it in the ball, at least I hope I put it in my bag. After that I just hope I get my release straightened out as a few times the Track was low.

I also went earlier to work on shortening up my approach. I took five steps from the foul line doing the belly walk and end up right at the front set of dots. Trying to do four steps from that point I ended up across the foul line every shot. I then moved back about a foot and would normally stop before the line unless I really rushed the last two steps, which is a really big issue and with the video I took no my phone looks like might be tied in to my swing.

Cal if you have done all of that and your feet are still rushing, that is telling me you are starting the ball too early and are having to run to catch up to the swing or your push away is way out in front of you.

Don't lock your elbow out until the ball falls to catch up with it at the bottom of the down swing. Start the ball just after your right foot moves by moving your elbow forward so your upper arm doesn't pass your chest while maintaining the elbow angle you start out with. This will give the ball the slight upward or "over the bar" feeling that John Jowdy talks about in his book Execution. After lifting the ball over the bar, round the ball into the swing, by that I mean you want to drop the ball into the swing but you want to have a more round feeling not a drop straight down as this will [censored] your elbow at the bottom and cause the ball to slip from your grip. So think right foot then up and around then down like a fish hook shape with the point of the hook at the start and the line end of the hook at your ankle, as opposed to a squared off move while dropping it into the swing if you can visualize what I'm telling you. If you need me to explain better let me know, it is much easier to explain in person.