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#51885 - 03/13/08 01:04 AM USBC ruling trouble
Dennis Michael Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9820
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
Last October, we had our first position night. Before we bowled, it was noticed that some of the teams had the wrong point total, and as a result, were bowling the wrong opponents. It affected 8 of our 16 teams. We had a meeting with the Captains and the House manager, where it was explained as a House computer system problem, and it could not be corrected that night. We voted to bowl that night as a regular night as the teams were set up, fix the computer data, and have a position night the following week.

After we bowled, and before the next week, a complaint was submitted to the local USBC Office. We narrowed it down to a team that lost all points that night, and as a result, was out of the running for the first place matchup when we did bowl position. The director from the USBC local Association came to our next league session and told us that our decision to bowl was invalid. We had quite a debate, that was settled with the Secretary being assigned to validate all scores submitted to the House system manually, and set up the proper matchup for our second position night. The House computer was to be corrected within the following week, if needed.

Last night, the Officers were informed that another complaint was submitted, claiming that the first night position results should never have been counted. Again, the USBC office ruled that we were in violation and that night should be rebowled by the end of the season. We can't figure this out. In the presence of the USBC Director, we came to a conclusion, and by a unanymous vote of Captains, made a decision, and all was satisfied, so we thought.

Now, we don't know if we have to bowl an additional week after the regular season ends, or not. And, that additional week may affect our first half results. Confusing, confusing, confusing. All because of a computer system error, and 1 upset bowler.

We checked our computer output tonight, and again found 8 teams with the incorrect point totals, caused by another computer error from last week. My team won 5 points last week and was credited with 0. But, being a regularly scheduled night, the line up of teams was not affected, just the team standings.

I kept my mouth shut, and spoke with the President during the night. There is a possibility that the scores and handicaps of those 8 teams was calculated incorrectly, and may cause an error in who wins or loses tonight. We will check that this week. What a mess!
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Registered: Fri Aug 27 2004
Posts: 10100
A/S/L: Mountain View, CA
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#51886 - 03/13/08 01:59 AM Re: USBC ruling trouble [Re: Dennis Michael]
Atochabsh Offline
USBC Bronze Coach

Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 6567
A/S/L: 50/F/California
I believe there's a time limit for complaints....two weeks. Anything submitted after two weeks is not actionable.

Erin

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#51892 - 03/13/08 08:47 AM Re: USBC ruling trouble [Re: Atochabsh]
Dennis Michael Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9820
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
Thanks, I'll use that.
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#51895 - 03/13/08 09:54 AM Re: USBC ruling trouble [Re: Dennis Michael]
AmpleSound Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 10/17/07
Posts: 1225
A/S/L: 34/M/CO
Man, what a mess, luckily the worst we deal with are the pin setter issues lol. Though we have had issues with a new team on the league pushing the envelope and messing with the scores for a few weeks. They weren't making up games in a timely manner and it threw off our first position round big time. Then they had issues with a teammate having to quit the league, and figuring out how to catch up with their weekly dues... Hope it gets straightened out for you Dennis!
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#51899 - 03/13/08 10:18 AM Re: USBC ruling trouble [Re: Dennis Michael]
CoachJim Offline
USBC Silver Coach

Registered: 09/19/06
Posts: 4665
A/S/L: Reston, Virginia USA
Dennis, you scared me, I thought for a second you were going to say that your 300 game didn't count or something to that effect.

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#51911 - 03/13/08 12:00 PM Re: USBC ruling trouble [Re: CoachJim]
Smooth23 Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 02/04/07
Posts: 146
A/S/L: 23/M/Jackson, MI
Why attack the '1 upset bowler'? If he brought a complaint, and they followed up on it and found out it was appropriate, it sounds like your anger is misguided. I understand it being a frustrating situation, but if I felt I was wronged and not getting the results I hoped for, I would go above the leagues head too.
After all, how many of us want to pay into a prize fund, just to get screwed out of any chance of money?


Edited by Smooth23 (03/13/08 12:01 PM)
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#51912 - 03/13/08 12:09 PM Re: USBC ruling trouble [Re: Smooth23]
Fin09 Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 01/07/08
Posts: 1163
A/S/L: 53/M/Virginia Beach, VA
Right, you're not rebowling because 1 upset bowler caught a mistake. You're rebowling because whoever entered the scores into the system made a mistake. Normally, you can either add a week to your schedule and reshoot the position round the next week, or bowl it on a non-league night at both teams' convenience. This can and will affect the standings, which will affect the distribution of the prize fund at the end of the season. People make mistakes- it's what makes them human.
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#51920 - 03/13/08 12:24 PM Re: USBC ruling trouble [Re: Fin09]
Dennis Michael Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9820
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
The rules are very clear in this matter. This is to be left up to the Officers and the Board of Directors which includes all Captains.

Yes, there was a computer problem, and we, the officers, couldn't fix it. The House recognized the error as theirs, and we moved toward a resolution. We discussed alternatives and concluded what we did was the appropriate resolution and fixed the computer data within a week.

This was agreed by a 100% concurring vote by the Captains and the Officers.

One disgruntled bowler, not a Captain, thinks the decision was inappropriate, and has voiced his objection to the Association, apparently twice.

The Association cannot, I believe, overrule the decision unless it goes against other standard rules of the USBC. Why they stuck their nose into this is beyond me? They should have referred this person to the Officers to handle the complaint, and it would be over.
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#51939 - 03/13/08 03:20 PM Re: USBC ruling trouble [Re: CoachJim]
Dennis Michael Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9820
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
Originally Posted By: CoachJim
Dennis, you scared me, I thought for a second you were going to say that your 300 game didn't count or something to that effect.


OMG, that would be heartbreaking!!!
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Legends - L/M New Terminator 15#
Legends - L/M Xtreme Damage 15# Strong pearl




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#51942 - 03/13/08 03:35 PM Re: USBC ruling trouble [Re: Dennis Michael]
Atochabsh Offline
USBC Bronze Coach

Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 6567
A/S/L: 50/F/California
We had a complaint voiced to us this year about a league that had a week cancelled on them by the house. The house choose a corporate party over their scheduled league play. As a result, they lost a week of bowling, thus now throwing the entire schedule off. In an effort to repair the scheduling problem one team played on the same pair of lanes two weeks in a row.

When the secretary came to us for suggestions we told her she'd done the best she could do and that there's always going to be someone that doesn't like the decision. The secretary was new to the software she was using and had no idea how to reset the schedule and avoid this situation. Then the ladies that were upset about the lane assignments came in and complained the next day, and we told them it wasn't a big deal. But if they wanted more resolution to have a league meeting and whatever was decided would stand. We guided them, we didn't get involved directly.

Erin

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