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#49999 - 02/19/08 11:16 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: Dennis Michael]
Smooth23 Offline
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Registered: 02/04/07
Posts: 146
A/S/L: 23/M/Jackson, MI
I agree with Dennis. The good houses do cater to real bowlers. Where I bowl, if you're a serious bowler and want good practice you can come in and they try to give you a pair of lanes with good oil on them, away from the kiddies. Also, though rock n bowl is a huge revenue builder for this house, they don't start till Midnight, and always keep open bowlers off lanes next to league bowling.
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#50000 - 02/19/08 11:18 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: Dennis Michael]
cgeorg Offline


Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 3567
A/S/L: Pittsburgh, Pa
I bet the scores at Augusta are better than the scores at the local $20 course. Does that say something bad about the local course? It's still getting people out there, allowing the sport to grow.
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#50001 - 02/19/08 11:21 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: Lefty]
Brian Longo Offline
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Registered: 05/23/06
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Originally Posted By: Lefty
So you care that non-bowlers think bowlers are fat sweaty guys in white beaters but you don't care that non-bowlers will find "turkey" just as ridiculous as "hambone"? It doesn't matter it's historical reference. It sounds silly. Personally I don't care that it sounds silly. If someone pointed out that it sounded silly (like Stone did), I'd laugh and agree with them. I also don't care if someone came up with another phrase that sounded just as silly.

Hey, "Southpaw" sounds silly, but it is what it is. Once I found out why a left-handed pitcher was named that, it made sense. Same with bowling. "Messenger" sounds silly, but there's nothing wrong with it. Hambone, coming from someone not associated with the sport, is not silly - it's stupid. I'm steadfast on that and you won't convince me otherwise. Call me "ignorant" on that if you wish, but I prefer to not be sacrilegious when it comes to the history of bowling. I have the same zeal for the history of other sports as well; baseball, football, basketball, etc.

Originally Posted By: Lefty
If you want professional bowling to have a future, you should start caring, because without more viewership and support, there won't be a PBA tour anymore.

There almost wasn't a future too long ago because of a lack of interest. Seems that the fact that bowling has nearly priced out families and the shots most places put out are a joke darn near killed any sort of "esteem" for the sport. Plus, as Dennis mentioned, these "gimmicks" that have come out have somewhat diminished the respect for the sport. Sure, there are quite a few "cosmic bowlers" who have converted to "league bowlers", and some are quite serious about the game, but overall, bowling still, to most people, is pure "recreation", much like "mini-golf".

Originally Posted By: Lefty
Honestly you've got some issues to deal with here. Anyone outside of bowling is going to think that Turkey sounds silly. That has nothing do with the stigma bowling has. You're not going convince anyone it's not silly or make bowling look any better by getting upset over the fact that it really is a silly phrase. Stone represents the vast majority of people who "turkey" sound silly to. We can either accept this, laugh with them while they get introduced to the game or we can get mad and alienate even more potential viewers and fans.

Yeah, I have issues. Maybe I need to see a therapist or something. Forgive me if I do not find the bastardization of bowling to be something to take lightly.

Originally Posted By: Lefty
Yes, it was contradictory. If you didn't care, why would you say "bad enough". If you didn't care, you wouldn't think it was bad.

Ok, so I do care. I care very much, in fact. I care about the history of the sport. I care about the future of the sport. I care so much that I was and am willing to spend my free time teaching people how to bowl and the history of the sport and trying to get them to care about it as much as I do. And yes, I'm a walking contradiction. There comes a certain time, though, when effort spent on "trying to educate the ignorant" becomes fruitless. Like you, I guess to a degree, I just throw my hands up and say "whatever", but I try to do my part and not let ignorance gather any more steam than it already has.

Originally Posted By: Lefty
Thou doth protest too much.

Thou doth not protest enough. If you want to sit there idly and allow someone to mock the sport, fine. If you want to sit there and say "turkey" sounds silly, fine. That's your choice. Does that make you any less of a person in my eyes? No. Does that make you any less of a fan or passionate of the sport? No. I still respect your opinion and respect you as a person.

However you want to approach the matter is how you'll approach it, just as I will approach it as I will. If I come off as a zealot, so be it. Yes, it strikes a nerve, and yes, I'll be reactionary about it.

At least we agree on one thing, and that is we want a brighter future for our sport. I, along with many others, just aren't happy with a new term that bears no meaning other than, in my eyes, being a mockery of something that's equally or more "silly" than turkey.
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#50002 - 02/19/08 11:21 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: sixbagger]
Dennis Michael Offline
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Registered: 12/11/05
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A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
There just are some things you DON'T do.
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#50003 - 02/19/08 11:30 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: cgeorg]
Dennis Michael Offline
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Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9820
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
Originally Posted By: cgeorg
I bet the scores at Augusta are better than the scores at the local $20 course. Does that say something bad about the local course? It's still getting people out there, allowing the sport to grow.


That is exactly my point. They are not allowed at Augusta.

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#50004 - 02/19/08 11:30 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: sixbagger]
Scott Gannon Offline
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Registered: 10/30/06
Posts: 967
A/S/L: 51/M/California
The only thing I have to weigh in on this is that Rob Stone is so full of himself and it is very annoying. It would be one thing if he just mentioned said after the fact that someone got a Hambone but he goes on and on before and after and even about Rhino Page having Hambone momentum going into next week.

I agree this is probably being propped up by ESPN. Any football fans who have ever tried to suffer through their Monday Night Football (formerly Sunday Night Football) will realize they have a knack for hiring obnoxious and overbearing announcers who have you reaching for the mute button.
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#50005 - 02/19/08 11:31 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: Dennis Michael]
Dennis Michael Offline
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Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9820
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
Too many lanes are co-mingling sport bowlers with recreational bowlers to the distain of Sport bowlers.
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#50006 - 02/19/08 11:38 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: Brian Longo]
Odyssey912 Offline
Action Bowler

Registered: 10/12/07
Posts: 213
A/S/L: 32/F/Pittsburgh,PA
Originally Posted By: Brian Longo
Monday night is a scratch league. Now, not everyone is a 200+ average bowler, but it is still a competitive and serious league. I was bowling 3 pairs down from a group of 20-25 year olds who were open bowling, one of which is a league bowler at the center I bowl at.

Talk about boorish; the girl who was with the league bowler was somewhat tipsy before she walked in the door, but as the night wore on, she became louder and was yelling quite often and was obviously drunk. It got to the point where she was such a distraction that her antics caused the bowlers on the pair left of us (which started the league pairings) to have to stop in mid-approach on more than one occasion. Complaints were lodged at the counter. The manager (who also bowls on the scratch league) said something to the girl and her boyfriend. Apparently all this did was agitate her and cause her to become more belligerent.

Now, she wasn't vulgar, but she was antagonizing to the point that she yelled, "don't y'all hear me? Wooooooooooo!" on a few occasions. The fact that she was acting like a drunken idiot didn't bother me too much. I half-expected it because she had on house shoes and was using a house ball. But the fact that her boyfriend, a league bowler, wasn't trying to settle the situation was most disturbing. Had it been me, I'd have been very embarrassed and quite apologetic to the league bowlers nearby, and would have stopped bowling and taken her out of there. I'm sure, though, he will get a few dirty looks and probably get a few nasty comments the next time he bowls in his league.

But, yeah, it's the lack of respect that was displayed last night that irritates me. Now, I'm friends with the manager, and he dealt with it in a timely manner, but with revenues as they are, I'm sure he was torn between "the dollar" and the rest of the league. Make no mistake, the bowlers beside this loudmouth, even the open bowlers, had their fair share of complaints after the drunken loudmouth left, and the manager was distraught, but sadly, it's the dollar that is most vocal. I can empathize with his position. I've been there a few times. I planned on saying something to both the bowler and his girlfriend as I was leaving, but they took off rather quickly after they finished their game.


I took my 4 year old (almost 5 year old) bowling a little while ago on a Sunday afternoon. As luck would have it it was a really slow afternoon so they were only running half the lanes and there was an afternoon league there.

Being that I had a 4 year old with me I asked to be placed as far away from the league as possible. They did their best (I think we were maybe 6 lanes away from the 1st set of league bowlers).

I have to tell you, and I am not just saying this because I am her mother, I honestly can't think of 1 thing that anyone could have complained about regarding my kid. She waited her turn (we obviously helped her with this as she was excited to be bowling), she celebrated only as loudly as everybody else, sat down and waited after she was done, etc.

Being a league bowler myself, I would have been so embarassed if something would have been said about my kid. But, then again, it would not have gotten that far. Anytime my kid acts out in public we leave the scene immediately. But that's just me.

I know this situation is a different than the boyfriend/girlfriend reference - but it shows the difference (I think). Even on days where I have had too much to drink, I didn't act like this.
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#50007 - 02/19/08 11:43 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: Odyssey912]
Dennis Michael Offline
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Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9820
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
Here, Here... to Melissa.

Need more mothers like you.
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#50008 - 02/19/08 11:47 AM Re: You think Pete likes Stone? [Re: Odyssey912]
Lefty Offline
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Registered: 01/30/05
Posts: 2356
A/S/L: 37 / M / Rochester, NY
Quote:

Yeah, I have issues. Maybe I need to see a therapist or something. Forgive me if I do not find the bastardization of bowling to be something to take lightly.


Quote:

Thou doth not protest enough. If you want to sit there idly and allow someone to mock the sport, fine.


Lol.. that's just the thing, he's NOT mocking the sport. He's having fun with it! And the fact that some people don't realize this makes them look like their butt cheeks are do tight that they couldn't pass a toothpick. Really, it comes across even more silly/stupid than turkey, hambone or both combined.

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