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#40654 - 02/08/07 09:53 PM Rules Question
Lefont Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 01/14/06
Posts: 187
A/S/L: 35/M/Atlanta
I've been reading the Rules Book and I cannot find the answer to a concern I have.

We're bowling a position round next week against a team that's been missing a bowler due to a shoulder injury for a couple of weeks. It's a bylaw of the league to not use any substitutes during position rounds. We heard last night that they were trying to replace the injured roster member with another bowler so they wouldn't lose playing strenght for that week. However, we know that the injured bowler intends to come back when he feels better and has not resigned from the league or given two weeks notice as stated by USBC Rules.

This team did the same thing in the second position round this year. They replaced another roster member on the same date of the position round.

I understand that a team has the right to reach player strength, but does that apply on a position round?

I'd appreciate any help on this. Thanks.

Leo
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Legend

Registered: Fri Aug 27 2004
Posts: 10100
A/S/L: Mountain View, CA
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#40659 - 02/08/07 10:37 PM Re: Rules Question [Re: Lefont]
Atochabsh Offline
USBC Bronze Coach

Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 6567
A/S/L: 50/F/California
Yes, unfortunately it does. But the player they replace has to officially quit the league. That means two week notice and most likely forfeiture of their prize fund. When you quit a league you don't get pro rated prize fund.

So they do not have a vacancy. A vacancy is when they have no player to take the spot within the team. They have a player but he cannot perform right now. You can only get your team up to full strength when you have a vacancy. This team does not have a vacancy, imo.

Its going to cause problems and it will require league meeting etc........ They have gotten away with it before because of weak officers and a "who cares" attitude from the other teams in the league.

Erin

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#40662 - 02/08/07 10:47 PM Re: Rules Question [Re: Atochabsh]
Lefont Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 01/14/06
Posts: 187
A/S/L: 35/M/Atlanta
Thanks Erin. I knew you would have some info on this. I guess we're going to be filing a protest if they try to pull the same stunt...

_________________________
My Equipment:

MoRich Awesome Hook - 14#
MoRich Total Shock & Awe - 14#
Brunswick Ultra Zone - 14#
MoRich Sahara - 14#

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#40664 - 02/09/07 12:16 AM Re: Rules Question [Re: Lefont]
Atochabsh Offline
USBC Bronze Coach

Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 6567
A/S/L: 50/F/California
see rule 114a

It basically says that he has to officially quit with a two week paid notice to get pro rated prize fund. And he can rejoin the same team later if sufficient cause is given and accepted. Or 2/3 rds WRITTEN CONSENT of the team captains if the bowler did NOT give proper notice and sufficient cause.

It sounds like in this case the bowler has never officially quit the league and therefore established a vacancy. If he has not paid though, an automatic vacancy can take place. Because failure to pay results in being removed from the league, thus creating a vacancy. So if he's paid, while he's been injured, then obviously he has not created a vacancy for failure to pay. And without two week prior notice, his paying doesn't amount to anything more then an absent bowler.

Erin

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#40665 - 02/09/07 12:19 AM Re: Rules Question [Re: Atochabsh]
Atochabsh Offline
USBC Bronze Coach

Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 6567
A/S/L: 50/F/California
If you are thinking protest then you have to follow rule 119 to the tee. No way around it. USBC will not even look at anything that has not been processed according to this rule.

Erin

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#40669 - 02/09/07 12:43 AM Re: Rules Question [Re: Atochabsh]
Brandon510 Offline
Legend

Registered: 08/05/06
Posts: 1990
A/S/L: 28/Male/California/Philippines
oh Wow i didnt know you had to give two weeks notice when you quit the league. hmm my two team amtes that quit gave me like three days notice. I told the league secetary said he take them off the following week. Good info to know then you have to give two weeks notice when quiting.

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#40692 - 02/09/07 11:01 AM Re: Rules Question [Re: Brandon510]
Atochabsh Offline
USBC Bronze Coach

Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 6567
A/S/L: 50/F/California
You can just walk and quit, but you are liable for two weeks of paying league fees. And if you don't, then process 119 maybe exacted upon you by the league.

Our two leagues have rules explaining the ramifications of quitting the league, especially where your prize fund money goes if you quit.

Erin

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#40750 - 02/10/07 12:57 AM Re: Rules Question [Re: Atochabsh]
Lefont Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 01/14/06
Posts: 187
A/S/L: 35/M/Atlanta
Thanks for Erin for the advice. I will read 119 just to make sure we're following procedure. I rather for them not to pull a stunt again, but I rather be prepared.

_________________________
My Equipment:

MoRich Awesome Hook - 14#
MoRich Total Shock & Awe - 14#
Brunswick Ultra Zone - 14#
MoRich Sahara - 14#

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#40757 - 02/10/07 08:39 AM Re: Rules Question [Re: Lefont]
Lefty Offline
Legend

Registered: 01/30/05
Posts: 2356
A/S/L: 37 / M / Rochester, NY
Erin - Here's a question. We had something similar happen in one my my leagues. Basically a person has a back injury that will keep them out for the rest of the season. There's a league rule that no one has really payed attention to (not that that makes it any less of a rule) that you can't bring in a sub with an average +10 above the person they're replacing during a the half season finals *IF* you're one of the 4 teams bowling in the championship. A little convoluted, but that's the rule.

Anyway, this team violated that rule with the sub they were using. They were a little annoyed because it wasn't their intention to stack their team. Their response was then that he was now a member of their team and not a sub.

I understand that you need to give notice for someone resigning, but is there a rule against adding someone to your roster? I know a lot of teams that carry more bowlers than spots and rotate. What's to stop someone from just adding someone to their roster?

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#40760 - 02/10/07 09:58 AM Re: Rules Question [Re: Lefty]
Atochabsh Offline
USBC Bronze Coach

Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 6567
A/S/L: 50/F/California
I don't think there's a general rule that allows for more players on a team then are slated to bowl. When you turn in your league sanction, the secretary usually, there's a place on there for how many teams you will have and how many people will constitute a team.

However, if you look at CAQ (commonly asked questions) #149 it says that without a league rule a team can have any number of designated or roving subs.

But it doesn't say the team can have any number of designated players. So these are subs. If your league has a rule concerning the qualifications of a sub then I'd think there was a violation there.

That's a good question though because you are right, I didn't see anything addressing the number of players a team can have. You could write bowl.com and see what they say. :-)

Erin

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