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#31895 - 05/24/06 02:15 AM Oil question
Gallo81 Offline
Junior

Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 23
A/S/L: 22/M/Mexico
Hi everyone,

Well I want to buy one of these 2 balls but I want to know which one will handle more oil.

Columbia300 - Action
RotoGrip - Epic Battle

Thank you a lot.
_________________________
Feel and Enjoy the Game.
GALLO

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Legend

Registered: Fri Aug 27 2004
Posts: 10100
A/S/L: Mountain View, CA
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#31896 - 05/24/06 09:48 AM Re: Oil question
Brian Longo Offline
Legend

Registered: 05/23/06
Posts: 1393
A/S/L: 37/M/Jacksonville, NC
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by Gallo81:
Hi everyone,

Well I want to buy one of these 2 balls but I want to know which one will handle more oil.

Columbia300 - Action
RotoGrip - Epic Battle

Thank you a lot.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Well, Gallo, I doubt my reply will help you a whole lot, but I'll give it a whirl.

Both balls are pretty similar in RG and Differential. The Epic Battle boasts a 2.48 RG and 0.050 differential for a 15 pound ball while the Action boasts a 2.457 RG and 0.050 differential for a 15 pound ball. The differences between the two are the weight block and the coverstock where the Epic Battle has a particle coverstock with a core that produces a "mass bias" and the Action has a sanded reactive coverstock with a symmetical core which does not produce a mass bias.

All things being equal, the Epic Battle will give you a smoother ball reaction with a stronger mid-lane roll than the Action, but their breakpoints will be similar.

Honestly, there is no ball made that will hook if there's enough oil to make it skid, which means you need a "hook area" or drier area on the lane to produce the desired reaction. When and where your ball hooks depends on the ball's surface and the amount of oil (or lack of oil) at that point on the lane.

So to give you the best answer, if you can tell us at what point on the lane you find your drier spots (or hook spots), that would be helpful. And when I mean location, I mean this:
-- Where down the lane does the ball want to hook at the arrows, halfway down the lane, or near the pins
-- Which arrow (or board) does the ball want to hook at: first arrow, second arrow, thrid arrow, fourth arrow, or between a combination of the two.

If you can supply this information, someone can give you a better answer to your question.

Also, for your reference, you can read about RG and Differential from this technical document from Columbia 300 . It might help you understand some parameters of ball recation not produced by you, the bowler. Please keep in mind, though, that maximum differential has been lowered from 0.080 to 0.060.
_________________________
"There are no magical balls, just magical bowlers"

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#31897 - 05/24/06 05:22 PM Re: Oil question
Gallo81 Offline
Junior

Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 23
A/S/L: 22/M/Mexico
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by Brian Longo:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by Gallo81:
[b] Hi everyone,

Well I want to buy one of these 2 balls but I want to know which one will handle more oil.

Columbia300 - Action
RotoGrip - Epic Battle

Thank you a lot.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Well, Gallo, I doubt my reply will help you a whole lot, but I'll give it a whirl.

Both balls are pretty similar in RG and Differential. The Epic Battle boasts a 2.48 RG and 0.050 differential for a 15 pound ball while the Action boasts a 2.457 RG and 0.050 differential for a 15 pound ball. The differences between the two are the weight block and the coverstock where the Epic Battle has a particle coverstock with a core that produces a "mass bias" and the Action has a sanded reactive coverstock with a symmetical core which does not produce a mass bias.

All things being equal, the Epic Battle will give you a smoother ball reaction with a stronger mid-lane roll than the Action, but their breakpoints will be similar.

Honestly, there is no ball made that will hook if there's enough oil to make it skid, which means you need a "hook area" or drier area on the lane to produce the desired reaction. When and where your ball hooks depends on the ball's surface and the amount of oil (or lack of oil) at that point on the lane.

So to give you the best answer, if you can tell us at what point on the lane you find your drier spots (or hook spots), that would be helpful. And when I mean location, I mean this:
-- Where down the lane does the ball want to hook at the arrows, halfway down the lane, or near the pins
-- Which arrow (or board) does the ball want to hook at: first arrow, second arrow, thrid arrow, fourth arrow, or between a combination of the two.

If you can supply this information, someone can give you a better answer to your question.

Also, for your reference, you can read about RG and Differential from this technical document from Columbia 300 . It might help you understand some parameters of ball recation not produced by you, the bowler. Please keep in mind, though, that maximum differential has been lowered from 0.080 to 0.060. [/b]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">
_________________________
Feel and Enjoy the Game.
GALLO

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#31898 - 05/24/06 05:29 PM Re: Oil question
Gallo81 Offline
Junior

Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 23
A/S/L: 22/M/Mexico
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Well, Gallo, I doubt my reply will help you a whole lot, but I'll give it a whirl.

Both balls are pretty similar in RG and Differential. The Epic Battle boasts a 2.48 RG and 0.050 differential for a 15 pound ball while the Action boasts a 2.457 RG and 0.050 differential for a 15 pound ball. The differences between the two are the weight block and the coverstock where the Epic Battle has a particle coverstock with a core that produces a "mass bias" and the Action has a sanded reactive coverstock with a symmetical core which does not produce a mass bias.

All things being equal, the Epic Battle will give you a smoother ball reaction with a stronger mid-lane roll than the Action, but their breakpoints will be similar.

Honestly, there is no ball made that will hook if there's enough oil to make it skid, which means you need a "hook area" or drier area on the lane to produce the desired reaction. When and where your ball hooks depends on the ball's surface and the amount of oil (or lack of oil) at that point on the lane.

So to give you the best answer, if you can tell us at what point on the lane you find your drier spots (or hook spots), that would be helpful. And when I mean location, I mean this:
-- Where down the lane does the ball want to hook at the arrows, halfway down the lane, or near the pins
-- Which arrow (or board) does the ball want to hook at: first arrow, second arrow, thrid arrow, fourth arrow, or between a combination of the two.

If you can supply this information, someone can give you a better answer to your question.

Also, for your reference, you can read about RG and Differential from this technical document from Columbia 300 . It might help you understand some parameters of ball recation not produced by you, the bowler. Please keep in mind, though, that maximum differential has been lowered from 0.080 to 0.060.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Well its hard to answer that question just how I put it and I know.

But here is the example: Yesterday I was using a Rebel ECX Black Sheen, and I was playing passed 12 in arrows goes down to 10 and at 40 or 42 feet was the break point, but I hadn't to much area for playing.

I want a Heavy Oil ball more than my Rebel ECX Black and I saw people with a similar shot like mine using The Action and the Epic Battle.

So I just want something that can hook much better with more area to play.

Here are the Specs of both balls:

Action
16 LBS
1 OZS
3 1/2 Top Weight
Pin 3.5"

Epic Battle
16 LBS
0 OSZ
2.32 Top Weight
Ping 2.5 to 3"

Thank you.

GALLO
_________________________
Feel and Enjoy the Game.
GALLO

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#31899 - 05/25/06 09:20 AM Re: Oil question
Brian Longo Offline
Legend

Registered: 05/23/06
Posts: 1393
A/S/L: 37/M/Jacksonville, NC
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by Gallo81:
Well its hard to answer that question just how I put it and I know.

But here is the example: Yesterday I was using a Rebel ECX Black Sheen, and I was playing passed 12 in arrows goes down to 10 and at 40 or 42 feet was the break point, but I hadn't to much area for playing.

I want a Heavy Oil ball more than my Rebel ECX Black and I saw people with a similar shot like mine using The Action and the Epic Battle.

So I just want something that can hook much better with more area to play.

Here are the Specs of both balls:

Action
16 LBS
1 OZS
3 1/2 Top Weight
Pin 3.5"

Epic Battle
16 LBS
0 OSZ
2.32 Top Weight
Ping 2.5 to 3"

Thank you.

GALLO
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Thanks for the information. It helps somewhat. Pretty much any mid-performance to high-performance ball should outdo the one you're using now. If your heart is set on these two balls, then here's my 2 cents, and I will say that, without watching you bowl and not knowing your style, it's still tough to give you a better answer.

There are 4 main factors that you, the bowler, bring in terms of ball reaction: speed, revs, axis tilt and axis rotation. What you need to quantify, for yourself, are these 4 components. A good Pro Shop operator can help you recognize those components.

As I said in my last post, with all factors being equal, the Epic Battle will give you a stronger and smoother breakpoint based on the asymmetrical core (mass bias) and particle coverstock. It will also tend to hook a little sooner than the Action. Both balls, though, should be an upgrade to what you're rolling now. And both of their surfaces can be tweaked to match you up with your shot.

If you want a little more controlled breakpoint, go with the Epic Battle. If you want a little more "pop" at the breakpoint, go with the Action. That is really the only differnce between the two balls other than the Epic Battle would probably handle changes in lane conditions a little longer.
_________________________
"There are no magical balls, just magical bowlers"

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