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#199430 - 05/22/18 08:00 AM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: Dennis Michael]
6_ball_man Offline
2X Virtual League Champion

Registered: 10/19/07
Posts: 858
A/S/L: 60/m/downtown churchville
We are (thankfully) of the 45' flat. It completely ate me up. UNfortunately, the next pattern looks crazier...the Slowinski "I Want My Momma" pattern, which has about the same volume as the 45' pattern but is 41'. There is a trough across the lane from 30'-40' and then a large, short increase in oil. The math says come offa the oil on the 10 board, but I am thinking this pattern will also require aggressive stuff. I do not expect many strikes on these patterns, but my spare game is on life support, so that is what I am going to focus on.
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In decreasing order of reaction:
Monster Kraken - box 2k dull
Storm Code Red (box finish)
Monster Loch Ness - 4k+polish
Brunswick Gold Rhino Pro (shiny)
Storm IQ Tour30 - 4k dull
Storm Polar Ice - 4k+polish

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equipment list too

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Legend

Registered: Fri Aug 27 2004
Posts: 10100
A/S/L: Mountain View, CA
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#199433 - 05/22/18 08:56 AM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: Dennis Michael]
Mkirchie Offline
Hall of Famer Contender

Registered: 01/14/07
Posts: 801
A/S/L: 38/M/New Jersey
I'll keep this thread going too. My attempt to fix my timing on Sunday was not really successful. I bowled well and much straighter with resin along with a mild 1-1.5 mph bump in ball speed. However, my timing wasn't much different and I still fight to get my ball into the swing early enough to get into time.

After looking up a bunch of stuff and further analyzing my video and the natural pace at which I walk compared to the time of my arm swing, I don't know if I want to mess with changing my feet too much. I was sort of pondering adding a 6th step but I think I've narrowed down the problem to where I hold my ball at the beginning of my approach. The ball is too close to my chest with my elbow bent too much (close to a right angle) and too far back to my side. I think this requires way too much time for my arm to straighten out before the ball enters the swing causing my excessively late timing. I want to try to get my elbow in front of my chest with my arm much closer to straight before I start moving the ball. It is something I want to try before I decide to try to change anything with my footwork. Not only do I know that my previous startig position is not working for me, I also know it is probably the easiest thing I can change to try to fix my timing.

Mark
_________________________
Current Average - 225
HG-300(12)
HS-789

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#199434 - 05/22/18 09:47 AM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: Mkirchie]
82Boat69 Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 646
A/S/L: 70/M/California
Years ago, The footwork that promoted timing was smooth with each step a little longer than the last with a long smooth slide at the end.

An old video of Marshal Holman will show you what it looked like.

Today, your footwork needs to have a 'gathering' step just before you reach the foul-line.

When we watch 2-handers hop, we forget that one handers do the same thing, just not as dramatic.

The whole point is to establish a solid fulcrum/foundation for the arm-swing. It's what allows the bowler to generate an accurate delivery with both speed and leverage.

Timing in the past and timing today are 2 different things. In the 60's, The ball and feet pretty much arrived at the foul-line together. Today, the footwork should be almost complete when the ball is still waist-high.

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#199435 - 05/22/18 10:27 AM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: 82Boat69]
Mkirchie Offline
Hall of Famer Contender

Registered: 01/14/07
Posts: 801
A/S/L: 38/M/New Jersey
I am pretty close to having my ball at waist height when my slide foot is just about stopped, if the end of the slide is what you mean by the end of the foot work. My problems are all before that point, when my 4th step hits flat on the approach, my ball is still rising in the back swing instead of being at it's peak. When I have my slide foot (5th step) flat on the approach and starting my slide, my ball is either at the peak or just barely starting to come down from the peak of my back swing. It results in the ball having to travel a large distance from the peak of my back swing through a large part of my slide step.

Mark
_________________________
Current Average - 225
HG-300(12)
HS-789

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#199436 - 05/22/18 10:38 AM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: Mkirchie]
82Boat69 Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 646
A/S/L: 70/M/California
Do you push-away or un-hinge? How high does your backswing go?

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#199437 - 05/22/18 11:02 AM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: 82Boat69]
Mkirchie Offline
Hall of Famer Contender

Registered: 01/14/07
Posts: 801
A/S/L: 38/M/New Jersey
Push-away as of right now, I want to adjust to a hinge and I think that changing my initial starting point of my arm should help me accomplish that. Backswing height is high, a bit above my head (I know it's a bit on the high side). Another piece of information is I don't think the ball is past my right leg when my third step hits flat on the approach.

Mark
_________________________
Current Average - 225
HG-300(12)
HS-789

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#199438 - 05/22/18 11:20 AM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: Mkirchie]
82Boat69 Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 646
A/S/L: 70/M/California
Are you aware of any delay in starting your ball? I use a 5 step approach and use my second step as the key to my timing.

At the very moment my right leg goes in front of my left, I want my ball dropping back into the empty space created.

The alternative is, a slight delay in step 3 to allow your backswing to reach it's peak. Personally, I don't like delays in the approach because they're not easily repeated.

I have a friend who says the perfect timing is to unhinge your ball and quickly walk away from it :-)

I actually put this into practice. I can start with my arm straight down or waist-high. Regardless, as my right leg goes in front of my left, the ball has to be passing into the empty space left behind me. It also assures your ball doesn't brush your hip on the way back.

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#199439 - 05/22/18 11:39 AM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: 82Boat69]
Mkirchie Offline
Hall of Famer Contender

Registered: 01/14/07
Posts: 801
A/S/L: 38/M/New Jersey
I know I'm delayed really badly in starting the ball and every time I try to fix it, I think I'm not delayed but I still am. My ball is not dropping until the beginning of my third step with my right foot even when I'm trying not to do that or think I'm not doing it. I agree, I would not want to do the pause either. I do use the beginning of my second step as my start in my five step approach, however I think that because my push away is so long that I can't get it into the swing soon enough for the third step. That is why I want to change to the hinge and alter my starting position so the ball travels much less to get into the swing.

Mark
_________________________
Current Average - 225
HG-300(12)
HS-789

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#199440 - 05/22/18 11:56 AM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: Mkirchie]
82Boat69 Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 646
A/S/L: 70/M/California
I pushed-away for over 50 years :-) Now I un-hinge. It allows me to hold the ball at any height to control speed, but to get it 'started' quickly. No delays un-hinging.

During my pre-shot, I intentionally break my wrist slightly and flex it back and forth to make certain it's loose. This helps to remove any tension in my hand, wrist and arm. When I do un-hinge, it falls away quickly.

Can you describe how your hand, wrist and arm feel just before you take your first step? Any tension will cause everything to slow down. A bad ball fit will do the same thing. If you have to hang on for dear life, that will require hand strength, which will cause tension all the way up your arm.

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#199441 - 05/22/18 02:01 PM Re: no one on for 5 days [Re: 82Boat69]
Mkirchie Offline
Hall of Famer Contender

Registered: 01/14/07
Posts: 801
A/S/L: 38/M/New Jersey
Without holding a ball itself at the moment, I can't really describe right now. I do know that I would have my wrist straight with my left hand under my right hand for support. I would imagine that having my elbow bent at almost 90 degrees before I take my first step is causing tension and making it hard to get started.

(Update, I held a 12 lb cylindrical mass in my hand to somewhat simulate the feel of holding a ball. When I hold it with my elbow bent and centered on the side of my torso like I have been doing, I can feel my biceps contracted to keep my arm bent as they oppose the torque from the ball. When I straighten my elbow out a little more and orient it closer to the front of my torso, there is much less stress and I could feel the ease of quickly dropping it into the swing.)

Mark
_________________________
Current Average - 225
HG-300(12)
HS-789

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