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#198081 - 08/28/17 08:39 AM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: nord]
Mkirchie Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 01/14/07
Posts: 690
A/S/L: 37/M/New Jersey
Originally Posted By: nord
Bowling needs to gain its respect back like it had in the old days.
I think that begins at the league level.
But if the houses don't care, then people in league are not educated and never learn to respect the game.

I agree, we've had a lot of people join the league who likely were bowling in their first league. Some had stayed, most have quit after a year or two. I would say that only a few who have stayed have actively tried to improve and learn more. I'm not expecting everyone to become really serious about the game, but I also don't understand how you could show up every week and not try to improve and learn at all.

One thing that always amazes me is how non-bowlers don't comprehend/know that more serious bowlers are doing something different than the recreational bowler who shows up once a year. In other words, I think that most of them feel that even serious bowlers are just rolling a ball down a lane carelessly and there is no skill, precision, or strategy involved to get more strikes/make spares.

I also agree with nord about the perks. The only league bowler perk we get is $1 off open bowling.

Mark
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#198082 - 08/28/17 09:08 AM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: Mkirchie]
82Boat69 Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 485
A/S/L: 69/M/California
Almost everyone I know who has bowled for many years started in a junior program. Where I grew up, there were 2 programs and we all bowled in both.

I don't see many kids bowling. They're more interested in electronic games, social media, etc.

Where I bowl high school kids bowl to fulfill their PE requirement, but there's no effort to teach or learn. A waste of time if you ask me.

Without young people coming along, I'd say tough times are coming for bowling well into the future.

Why actually bowl when you can sit on your butt and bowl on your iPhone? LOL!
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#198083 - 08/28/17 12:03 PM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: 82Boat69]
mmalsed Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 10/18/10
Posts: 1313
A/S/L: 43/M/Riverside, CA
Originally Posted By: 82Boat69
I bowl in a senior scratch league and every year at the league meeting I make a motion we have a urethane/plastic week once each month. No takers. I then make a motion to shoot a sport-shot once each month. Again, no takers.

Egos die hard :-)


I am not sure it's ego - if I were bowling for an enjoyable night out (which is mostly what my leagues are) then I really don't want to bowl in a semi-masochistic fashion. smile I did not go to the Open for an enjoyable weekend. LOL

I would LOVE to see a competitive, match-point, semi-sport shot league (maybe sport, maybe just a touch less than sport as an introduction. . . make the shot "hard" without going full sadistic. . . you know?) - I would definitely consider bowling in that, especially if it were not all about money (keep it reasonably priced. . .) - it would be nice. I could bowl with my family on the recreational league, and then bowl on the competitive league.
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#198085 - 08/28/17 12:34 PM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: 82Boat69]
champ Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 11/30/10
Posts: 2096
A/S/L: 30/M/AZ
Originally Posted By: 82Boat69
Without young people coming along, I'd say tough times are coming for bowling well into the future.


It isn't young people, and it isn't bowling. Its an across the board societal shift away from community/participation.

I've participated in competitive highpower rifle shooting, softball leagues, track and field, my brother is a golfer, my sister plays tennis, my best friend is very into competitive darts and pool...

Everyone is complaining about the same things bowling is. Its across the board. Every participatory sport is hurting for members, teams, and/or venues to have their fun. And when I go on forums for other hobbies I'm involved in, I have to remind those people of the same thing. Its not just "us" its "all of us."

Heck, I hear the same is true at churches, movie theaters, amusement parks, you name it.

People are less interested in leaving their house. It started with home air conditioners, continued with computer, video games, and the internet, and advances more with free two-day delivery of anything you could possibly want.

So the good news is, we don't have to fix bowling. We just have to fix our society wink
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#198087 - 08/28/17 02:33 PM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: mmalsed]
82Boat69 Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 485
A/S/L: 69/M/California
THS's become a strike-fest where even poor spare shooters can excel. Taking the block off the lane or removing the technology isn't masochistic, it's challenging :-)
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#198089 - 08/28/17 02:54 PM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: nord]
steveA Offline
Regional Pro Contender

Registered: 12/21/12
Posts: 558
A/S/L: 57/male/newcastle:uk
My biggest league is 8 team trios and I think this year we'll be down to 7 and that's the largest league in the house.
8 from that league make up teams for the doubles as partners
There's other leagues on during the week, singles again quite a few from the trios , and a another 2 doubles . House has leagues on 5 times a week but 70% of bowlers ,bowl in two or more , so not massive depth of players.

Think it's more a case of people don't want to commit to doing something every week, whatever the option is
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#198090 - 08/28/17 05:54 PM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: nord]
goobee Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 02/25/15
Posts: 483
A/S/L: 58/M/Sunny California
My league changed houses and went from 31 teams to 40. Length went from 32 weeks to 42. This is a Vegas league so most of the bowlers are average to above average. It's possible to grow it seems. We begin the season on Sept 9.
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#198094 - 08/29/17 10:20 AM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: nord]
Dennis Michael Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9530
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
That's a pretty large league. Especially when most lanes around here don't exceed 40 lanes.

I guess I'm kind of traditional. I prefer a league of 34 weeks duration and 18 teams. In this way, you get to bowl every team twice during the year. Add a week for a playoff.

My league last year was so large (32 teams), I didn't even know who rolled in the playoff. As I never bowled against either of them through the year.
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#198099 - 08/29/17 12:45 PM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: 82Boat69]
mmalsed Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 10/18/10
Posts: 1313
A/S/L: 43/M/Riverside, CA
Originally Posted By: 82Boat69
THS's become a strike-fest where even poor spare shooters can excel. Taking the block off the lane or removing the technology isn't masochistic, it's challenging :-)


It depends on how far you want to go.

I'm not saying don't make it challenging. I'm just saying that we seem to want to go to extremes (in all areas, lol).

We have the technical ability to put down darned near ANY shot we want. How about one that rewards spare shooting a bit, and makes it maybe 20% tougher to shoot strikes? We all know that a sport shot is FAR more than 20% harder. . . so instead of going from say a 10:1 ratio, side to side, and a 35 foot taper, how about dropping it to 5:1 and a 40 foot taper. That would be challenging, but not punishing. A nice mid-point between a sport shot (2:1 and 40'+) or even the US Open shot (1.75:1, 43 feet and very little taper, as per Kegel) and a normal house shot.

Call it a challenge league and then don't charge an arm and a leg to bowl it. Most of the higher skill leagues (sports shots or whatever) charge an arm and a leg and half your chest to bowl them. We can't even afford the league we're in (we're leaving at the end to join one that's much more reasonable) so why would I pay MORE for something that my wife and in-laws won't enjoy?
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#198100 - 08/29/17 01:36 PM Re: Reactive Balls are designed to be throw hard! [Re: mmalsed]
82Boat69 Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 485
A/S/L: 69/M/California
I agree. We tried to get a PBA Challenge league going but only a few signed up. I may need to drive 20 miles to find a condition that's not so predictable. Around here the only difference between THS's is the length. Ours is 41 feet. People who come from houses where the pattern is only 38 feet, think ours is tough :-) I guess 'challenging' is in the eyes of the beholder. What makes 41 feet tough is the number of 'flat' tens that get left because the ball finishes later. Anyone who isn't a solid 10 pin shooter will suffer.
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