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#195236 - 09/27/16 06:06 AM i have to give up on him i am afraid
Dirkus Offline
Bumper Bowler

Registered: 12/31/15
Posts: 4
A/S/L: male
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hvilt9bp2Jo

ok , before you start with gripproblems . i made him buy 3 new balls drilled by one of the best ball drillers arround . that is surely not the problem . i made him do foulline , 1-step ,3-step drill etc. i let him swing several times before he actually starts. Everything fine until he gets into his final swing . than he starts turning his hand and pulling the arm behind his back.
i told him to turn his hand (thumb to 2 oŽclock ) i let him swing to the left . pushaway to the left and than straight back to the right omg
look for yourself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dWgWy45ILI
His left arm goes to the front a lot
His handpostion sucks. His laydownpoint is too far away from the foot .

Help! i think its useless !

please comment on the youtubevideos
that way i receive the answers faster !

thanks

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Legend

Registered: Fri Aug 27 2004
Posts: 10100
A/S/L: Mountain View, CA
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#195240 - 09/27/16 11:38 AM Re: i have to give up on him i am afraid [Re: Dirkus]
mmalsed Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 10/18/10
Posts: 1381
A/S/L: 43/M/Riverside, CA
It's not his grip.

In the second video, when you have him swing the ball, notice that it starts inside (in the front) and swings outside (to the rear) - NOT straight as it should.

Now - notice that his swing IS ON that same path.

Instead - have him hold the ball farther to the right, then, as he drops the ball into his swing, it will actually be in the line you want.


BUT**** the main problem is not that either. The main problem is his steps. Nothing starts at the right time and he is trying to muscle the ball through to the end.

He's using a four step approach - so we'll count from there.

First step - push away. Ball and foot should extend the same amount AT THE SAME TIME. His foot is planted before he really starts moving the ball.

Second step - drop the ball into the swing. As Norm Duke says, the ball weight should be on the right arm when the second step hits. Your guy has a HUGE hesitation between first and second step (likely to fix the fact that his first step is so early) so that the ball is at the bottom of the swing when he starts his second step. So now his ball is WAAAY ahead of his feet.

Third step - this should be a stutter step, but not quick. It sets up the slide. But he's running because his ball was way ahead of his feet and he feels like he has to catch up. At this point he should already have the ball at the top of his backswing and be ready to start the delivery, but he's now ahead of his ball.

Fourth step - this should actually be just a touch ahead of his ball, but since he's been running, he's waaay ahead of his ball. Now he has to grab his ball and yank it through, pulling his ball to the left.

Don't give up on him. Give a shot at watching some Norm Duke, starting with the setup, through the stance and pushaway, etc. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxmjBuun2zc
_________________________
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#195242 - 09/27/16 12:07 PM Re: i have to give up on him i am afraid [Re: mmalsed]
djp1080 Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 453
A/S/L: 71/m/IL
Here's a full list of Norm's tips:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJUtsggOces&list=PLVreCPx4g0wZByQt9VvA_NinS0lmVrAxI

These and Richard Shockley's videos to me are the best.
Great post mmalsed...

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#195244 - 09/27/16 03:53 PM Re: i have to give up on him i am afraid [Re: Dirkus]
spr3wr Offline
USBC Bronze Level Coach

Registered: 08/19/06
Posts: 557
A/S/L: 54/m/MICHIGAN
take him to a certified bowling coach.

in the 1st video his swing was straight until the ball past his body .


Edited by spr3wr (09/27/16 04:04 PM)
_________________________
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High game 300 X 2
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#195249 - 09/28/16 06:21 AM Re: i have to give up on him i am afraid [Re: mmalsed]
Dirkus Offline
Bumper Bowler

Registered: 12/31/15
Posts: 4
A/S/L: male
what i am doing with him is the slowinsky swing drill . in order to fix this going aroung the back issue slowinsky uses this drill to correct it and get the swing into a straight line. trust me all i am doing is based on drills basically found on youtube and presented by coaches . we are here in germany there are no good coaches. At least not in my area. As you can see the drill helped in a way .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r7vsapM5J8
the ball is behind his head in the backswing now but when he comes down on the swing he is going out .....too far away from his ankle . His release is bad i know but that is a different thing now iŽll fix that when his swing is in line because than he can keep his hand more behind the ball

i know dukes videos too thank you !!

i need help in this special case .....

how to keep him from going away from his body on the downswing .
Towel wont help i tried that too ...

Dirk

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#195250 - 09/28/16 06:35 AM Re: i have to give up on him i am afraid [Re: mmalsed]
Dirkus Offline
Bumper Bowler

Registered: 12/31/15
Posts: 4
A/S/L: male
Thank you for your advice . i ll try my best

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#195251 - 09/28/16 09:38 AM Re: i have to give up on him i am afraid [Re: Dirkus]
djp1080 Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 453
A/S/L: 71/m/IL
Dirkus,
The one-step drill is a great one!
Another is the foul line drill where the bowler gets in the finish position very near the foul line with his non slide leg in a balanced position. Then the bowler swings the ball back and forth very near his slide leg two or three times and finally lets it go. The bowler should not throw the ball. Let the ball go at the bottom of the swing with little or no effort.
Hope this helps...

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#195264 - 09/29/16 12:07 PM Re: i have to give up on him i am afraid [Re: Dirkus]
mmalsed Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 10/18/10
Posts: 1381
A/S/L: 43/M/Riverside, CA
Originally Posted By: Dirkus
what i am doing with him is the slowinsky swing drill . in order to fix this going aroung the back issue slowinsky uses this drill to correct it and get the swing into a straight line. trust me all i am doing is based on drills basically found on youtube and presented by coaches . we are here in germany there are no good coaches. At least not in my area. As you can see the drill helped in a way .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r7vsapM5J8
the ball is behind his head in the backswing now but when he comes down on the swing he is going out .....too far away from his ankle . His release is bad i know but that is a different thing now iŽll fix that when his swing is in line because than he can keep his hand more behind the ball
i know dukes videos too thank you !!
i need help in this special case .....
how to keep him from going away from his body on the downswing .
Towel wont help i tried that too ...
Dirk


Dirk - I don't think it's his swing that is the problem. It's his footwork/rhythm. That causes a LOT of swing issues because we try to pull the ball up or down to get it in sync and THAT is where the problem crops up.

If your footwork/rhythm is okay, your swing is a MUCH better chance of being okay. If your footwork/rhythm is bad, your swing has almost ZERO chance of being okay.

Start there.
_________________________
Avg: 206
Season High Gm: 279 / Lifetime: 290
Season High Ser: 762 / Lifetime: 762

16# IQ Tour Pearl/16# Crux/16# Marvel S/15#White Dot

"Gotta kick at the darkness 'till it bleeds daylight"

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#195265 - 09/29/16 12:40 PM Re: i have to give up on him i am afraid [Re: mmalsed]
82Boat69 Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 681
A/S/L: 71/M/California
The drill you call the Slowinsky drill is being performed incorrectly.

The bowler's upper body angles are non-existent. Have the bowler assume a relaxed finish position with the balance leg behind him and going out to his left. This will cause his upper torso to slightly open.

Now, have the bowler bend at the waste and place his ball on the approach next to his left foot. Notice the spine tilt that this creates.

Now, have the bowler lift a couple of inches and swing the ball under his right shoulder. Done properly, the ball will swing back very slightly outside-in and swing forward very slightly inside-out.

Done properly, the bowlers swing slot will be under his shoulder and the bowlers head will be over the swing slot.

This drill is to teach the bowler the proper position of his upper body in relationship to his feet during the approach.

In a 4 step or 5 step approach, the key is the right foot crossing over or in front of the left foot. First step for a 4 step, second step for a 5 step. This step clears the area where a relaxed swing comes back into.

http://www.bowlersreference.com/Approach/Swing/

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#195287 - 10/01/16 11:57 AM Re: i have to give up on him i am afraid [Re: Dirkus]
spr3wr Offline
USBC Bronze Level Coach

Registered: 08/19/06
Posts: 557
A/S/L: 54/m/MICHIGAN
After watching the video it appears the problem is from the hand being on the outside of the ball during the swing and release. The hand should rotate a little during the swing so that the thumb should be pointing straight up/forwards not towards the body.

http://s943.photobucket.com/user/spr3wr/media/hand%20outside_zpsk4rzxies.png.html


The ovals are your fingers / hand when during the drill try to swing with your thumb/hand in the correct position .
_________________________
USBC Bronze level Coach
Ritger'S level 1 coach
High game 300 X 2
High series 810
Current ave. 213

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