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#194459 - 06/29/16 03:41 PM Drilling Pattern
RGR Offline
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Registered: 06/11/16
Posts: 147
A/S/L: 62/m/Ontario
What drilling pattern would you use for a rev challenged person. I do not throw a lot of hook, just a good drilling pattern to start with. Right handed thrower.

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#194460 - 06/29/16 05:46 PM Re: Drilling Pattern [Re: RGR]
82Boat69 Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 647
A/S/L: 70/M/California
More info please. Grip? (Conventional, semi, full). Full-roller or 3/4 roller? Age? Speed? Ave? Lane Condition? Whatever layout you choose, you'll want to store all the energy that you have in your release for when the ball hits the pins. This information will help determine how to accomplish that.

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#194462 - 06/30/16 09:20 AM Re: Drilling Pattern [Re: 82Boat69]
RGR Offline
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Registered: 06/11/16
Posts: 147
A/S/L: 62/m/Ontario
Okay, 3/4 roller, fingertip, 62 yrs. speed about 14 -17 ave. 180, lane condition, I call it house shot. My hook right now is about, maybe 5 boards top. I like to play outside because that is where the less amount of oil is. I would like a second opinion from my Pro Shop.

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#194463 - 06/30/16 10:36 AM Re: Drilling Pattern [Re: RGR]
82Boat69 Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 647
A/S/L: 70/M/California
Most pro shops either use PSA drilling or dual angle drilling. I'm going to explain in dual angle terms.

It's always best to have a person watch you bowl. But, I can suggest some things and explain why. If you don't know what your positive axis point is, have your local Pro Shop locate it for you.

When you throw your ball, if it's a modern ball with a core, it will skid, hook and roll. During the first 2 phases, skid and hook, energy is scrubbed off your shot. Energy is whatever speed and revolutions you put on your ball as it leaves your hand.

If you're rev-challenged, then you're probably a stroker. Nothing that a Pro Shop can drill will change you from a stroker to a tweener. A tweener is in-between a stroker and a cranker.

However, the Pro Shop can choose a ball and a layout that won't scrub off anymore energy that it has to as your ball goes down the lane.

There's something called the 'Perfect Scale' that ranks bowling ball surface aggression. The scale runs between 0 and 300. A Storm 'Lock' would be about 232 and a Storm 'Tropical Breeze' would be about 125. A plastic ball would be 5. If you go to bowlingball.com it will show the perfect scales for most balls you can buy today. I would stay away from balls above 175. They will scrub of rev's too fast for you.

If you throw a 15 pound ball you might consider 14. You'll gain energy and not lose too many hits in the process. A ball I like is an Ebonite 'Cyclone'. You might keep it in mind.

Each modern ball also has some technical specs like RG, flare potential and differential. Modern balls also come with symmetric and asymmetric cores. Stay with symmetric cores. Asymmetric use energy faster. Go with an RG value above 2.50 and a differential lower than .08. These values can also be found on BB.com.

When a ball goes down the lane, friction causes it to slow down. As it slows down it hooks. As the ball hooks, it flares and the more flare the more energy is lost. High RG low diff balls will minimize flare. The moderate perfect scale value will reduce friction going down the lane.

After picking a ball that won't burn-up going down the lane, you'll want a layout that will take advantage of whatever energy you have left. Dual angles allow you to match up a layout with the skid, hook and roll phases. For example, a dual angle layout of
50 x 5 x 50 will create an arcing hook profile. It's easy to control but uses up energy earlier. For down and in play, you'll want a ball to skid further, hook more moderately and still have some energy left when the ball rolls into the pocket.

An Ebonite 'Cyclone' has a perfect scale of 167, an RG of 2.53 and a differential around .05. I think it would be a good choice. You'll want to drill it dual angle something like
60 x 4.5 x 40.

The 167 perfect scale will get the ball down the lane with minimum loss of energy. The 60 degree drilling angle will get you down 35-40 feet before the ball will want to hook. The 4.5 inch pin to PAP value will turn the ball left but will be gradual enough that you won't flare out. The 40 degree VAL angle will have a more arcing look than a snap.

I'm 68, a 3/4 roller, medium speed and average over 200. I'm a tweener. I can stand left and arc the ball if I need to, but would rather shoot more down and in. My arsenal contains a Storm 'Lock', a Global 900 'Black Ops', an Ebonite 'Cyclone' and a Columbia 'Blue Dot' circa 1978 for spares. The 'Cyclone' is my favorite. On drier lanes I have a 'Tropical Breeze' and a Motiv 'Apex' I use. I've been experimenting with dual angles for about 3 years and due to high Pro Shop costs have started drilling my own equipment. I have 16 perfectos and have shot back to back 300's twice. Most recently at age 67. I've had back surgery and have metal plates holding my lower back together. Here's a video; https://vimeo.com/124909985. It means I've figured out what works and what doesn't. I hope what I said helps.

Run everything I've said past your pro. Good luck!

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#194464 - 06/30/16 12:24 PM Re: Drilling Pattern [Re: RGR]
djp1080 Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 432
A/S/L: 71/m/IL
Originally Posted By: RGR
What drilling pattern would you use for a rev challenged person. I do not throw a lot of hook, just a good drilling pattern to start with. Right handed thrower.


If you're buying a new ball, the drilling pattern is likely not the key to improving the number of revs; however, the fit is one of the keys to better bowling.
I, too, was a rev challenged bowler to start. I believe that I've moved from being a stroker to a tweener. How is that possible? I've spent many sessions with an excellent coach and have paid attention to what he was trying to show me. Made changes to the fit of my ball so that I can relax my hand and not having the feeling like it was going to fall off anywhere along the swing. My thumb pitch is forward rather than reverse and my finger pitches are reverse rather than forward or zero. Been successful in taping my thumb hole using a tiered method so as to fill in the gap at the end of my thumb to keep me from having to grab at the ball at all.
Fit is key from a good Pro Shop owner. Finding a good coach will be very beneficial as well to help the both of you to identify what you should work on to improve your enjoyment of the game.
Good luck!

Oh and by the way... I started out standing on board 15 and aiming around board 5 or so. Today I'm usually standing on board 23 or 24 and aiming at boards 8 or 9. I think that's a pretty drastic change


Edited by djp1080 (06/30/16 12:27 PM)

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#194466 - 06/30/16 04:37 PM Re: Drilling Pattern [Re: djp1080]
RGR Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 06/11/16
Posts: 147
A/S/L: 62/m/Ontario
Thanks for the info

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#194467 - 06/30/16 04:40 PM Re: Drilling Pattern [Re: 82Boat69]
RGR Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 06/11/16
Posts: 147
A/S/L: 62/m/Ontario
Thanks never had it explained to me that way. I'll see what I can do.

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#194468 - 06/30/16 05:59 PM Re: Drilling Pattern [Re: RGR]
82Boat69 Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 647
A/S/L: 70/M/California
Read this; http://kmtballjig.com/images/DUAL_ANGLE_LAYOUT_TECHNIQUE.pdf

Keep in mind that 85 percent plus of a ball's reaction is based on it's surface. Less than 15 percent is based on how the ball is drilled.

Ball drillers attempt to start the core at its most destabilized position based on a individuals axis rotation and axis tilt. Usually, end-over-end. Once axis rotation returns to 0 and axis tilt returns to 0, the ball will only roll in a straight line.

This is why it's so important to ration-out energy as the ball goes down the lane. If the ball begins to roll too early, it will hit like a marshmallow.

There's an old bowling adage that states "dry lanes make strong balls weak and weak balls strong". When you bowl league and the lanes break down, don't move left with a stronger ball, instead use a weaker ball and ask less from it.

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#194474 - 07/01/16 03:53 PM Re: Drilling Pattern [Re: 82Boat69]
RGR Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 06/11/16
Posts: 147
A/S/L: 62/m/Ontario
Now that I am retired, I'm at the point that I want to know. So I will asking a lot of questions that is hard to get answers to in the small town I live in. Some might be dumb, but I want to learn so be easy on me. Today I went to the alley to test out the weak ball and aggressive ball that you told me about. The two balls were the unhinged and skid. The skid was hard to control, and just seemed that it just wasn't there. The unhinged, which I checked out and was at the higher number that you said, was more forgiving and seemed to hit harder, so I am impressed. Did not know before. I am still working on getting the proper thumb pitch, I don't think it's quite right, I'll ask that question later. I do have a question to ask. But I'll stop here right now. Thanks

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#194475 - 07/01/16 11:05 PM Re: Drilling Pattern [Re: RGR]
82Boat69 Offline
Touring Pro Contender

Registered: 06/24/16
Posts: 647
A/S/L: 70/M/California
If you go looking on the internet for info regarding fitting a person for drilling, there's not much out there. The guru of ball fitting for many years was Bill Taylor. His book was considered the bible of ball fitting but is out of print now. Here's a website with info from that book.

https://issuu.com/franknz/docs/bill_taylor_fitting_drilling_a_bowl

As you go through you will find reference tables about finger pitches and thumb pitches based on grip span.

Feel free to ask me anything anytime. If I don't know the answer I'll find out who does and give you a place to find it. I rarely sleep so you can expect answers 24/7 :-)

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