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#193214 - 01/07/16 10:59 PM How to get more backswing?
BowlerBill Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 09/08/13
Posts: 435
A/S/L: 55/m/Ca
I've only been bowling since September of 2011. If 57 and not in the best physical condition. My backswing is barely at the belt level. I think this hinders my game.

Is there a drill or something I can do to get it a little higher?

Thanks,

Bill
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#193216 - 01/07/16 11:51 PM Re: How to get more backswing? [Re: BowlerBill]
Dennis Michael Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9820
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
hold ball higher in presentation. Push out to gain more speed. and, lean forward in approach.
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#193217 - 01/08/16 08:55 AM Re: How to get more backswing? [Re: BowlerBill]
looseleftie Offline
Hall of Famer Contender

Registered: 01/31/09
Posts: 882
A/S/L: 45 m
Firstly, how slow are u bowling at present?

Also just looking at your profile, it appears u can shoot some nice scores, so u are already doing a lot of things right with your game. .
Bill, another observation/suggestion is that u accelerate the swing just before release, and be strong with release.. like pushing a kids swing.. push when the ball for ex is nearing your slidong knee.. this will give u an instant mph or possibly more for nothing ....
The best thing for all to see would be a video perhaps before offering advice though..


Edited by looseleftie (01/08/16 09:00 AM)

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#193220 - 01/08/16 04:03 PM Re: How to get more backswing? [Re: Dennis Michael]
BowlerBill Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 09/08/13
Posts: 435
A/S/L: 55/m/Ca
Originally Posted By: Dennis Michael
hold ball higher in presentation. Push out to gain more speed. and, lean forward in approach.
e

I've tried to hold the ball higher and push out. These are good tips that help. I haven't tried increasing tilt yet. I'll give that one a shot. Thanks.
_________________________
Mission X, Shatter, Rhino Pro, Virtual Gravity, Disorder, White Dot, Critical
HG 300 (sanctioned),

HS 805 (250, 300, 255) (non-sanctioned)
746 (267, 257, 222) (sanctioned)

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#193221 - 01/08/16 04:17 PM Re: How to get more backswing? [Re: looseleftie]
BowlerBill Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 09/08/13
Posts: 435
A/S/L: 55/m/Ca
Originally Posted By: looseleftie
Firstly, how slow are u bowling at present?

Also just looking at your profile, it appears u can shoot some nice scores, so u are already doing a lot of things right with your game. .
Bill, another observation/suggestion is that u accelerate the swing just before release, and be strong with release.. like pushing a kids swing.. push when the ball for ex is nearing your slidong knee.. this will give u an instant mph or possibly more for nothing ....
The best thing for all to see would be a video perhaps before offering advice though..


I'm not sure what my ball speed is. I'd guess in the 15-16 mph range.

I concentrate on acceleration through the shot. This really helps.

I have nights at the lanes where I feel really good and score well. Other nights, I struggle because my timing is off a little.

I worked in the IT field during my career so I am conditioned to always improve something. At this moment it's bowling. My average the past 3 years has been between 206 and 210. I want to jump up a few more points. The only way to improve is to fix flaws.

I signed up for xtra frame and have been watching the pros. They all seem to have powerful games. I'd like to see my game get fluid and simple like Parker Bohn III or Norm Duke, if that is at all possible.

I have posted a few videos in the other forum.

Thanks for the advice and tips.
_________________________
Mission X, Shatter, Rhino Pro, Virtual Gravity, Disorder, White Dot, Critical
HG 300 (sanctioned),

HS 805 (250, 300, 255) (non-sanctioned)
746 (267, 257, 222) (sanctioned)

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#193225 - 01/09/16 08:26 AM Re: How to get more backswing? [Re: BowlerBill]
BOSStull Offline
2x Virtual League Champion

Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 1238
A/S/L: 63/M /Georgia
Originally Posted By: BowlerBill
Originally Posted By: Dennis Michael
hold ball higher in presentation. Push out to gain more speed. and, lean forward in approach.
e

I've tried to hold the ball higher and push out. These are good tips that help. I haven't tried increasing tilt yet. I'll give that one a shot. Thanks.


Read Ron Clifton's article How High Can A Free Swing Go?
Basically this is how I achieve a higher back swing and I think it is what Dennis is referring to on the lean forward. It is still an effortless free swing with no muscling .


Edited by BOSStull (01/09/16 09:42 AM)
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#193227 - 01/09/16 09:58 AM Re: How to get more backswing? [Re: BOSStull]
BowlerBill Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 09/08/13
Posts: 435
A/S/L: 55/m/Ca
Originally Posted By: BOSStull
Originally Posted By: BowlerBill
Originally Posted By: Dennis Michael
hold ball higher in presentation. Push out to gain more speed. and, lean forward in approach.
e

I've tried to hold the ball higher and push out. These are good tips that help. I haven't tried increasing tilt yet. I'll give that one a shot. Thanks.


Read Ron Clifton's article How High Can A Free Swing Go?
Basically this is how I achieve a higher back swing and I think it is what Dennis is referring to on the lean forward. It is still an effortless free swing with no muscling .


Excellent link. Thank you.
_________________________
Mission X, Shatter, Rhino Pro, Virtual Gravity, Disorder, White Dot, Critical
HG 300 (sanctioned),

HS 805 (250, 300, 255) (non-sanctioned)
746 (267, 257, 222) (sanctioned)

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#193236 - 01/10/16 07:43 AM Re: How to get more backswing? [Re: BowlerBill]
spr3wr Offline
USBC Bronze Level Coach

Registered: 08/19/06
Posts: 557
A/S/L: 54/m/MICHIGAN
Originally Posted By: BowlerBill
Originally Posted By: Dennis Michael
hold ball higher in presentation. Push out to gain more speed. and, lean forward in approach.
e

I've tried to hold the ball higher and push out. These are good tips that help. I haven't tried increasing tilt yet. I'll give that one a shot. Thanks.


Holding the ball higher for a higher backswing doesn't work for most people. It just places the ball into the swing later. As we mention before in your other post. slow down your foot speed. This will allow the ball more time to reach a higher position.

Remember that the swing needs to match the timing of the player.

After looking at videos of you from 1 and 2 yrs ago you haven't changed much. You have fast feet with that said , if you want a higher backswing then you need to hold the ball lower to match up with your footwork. A bowler who gets the ball into the swing early in relation to the footwork will tend to have a higher backswing. Conversely, a bowler who gets the ball into the swing late in relation to the footwork will tend to have a lower backswing.
Timing is the sequencing of the feet, when the ball is put into motion, and the spacing of each step. Usually, the earlier the ball is placed into the swing, the higher the swing can go and still be in the proper timing window.With your fast feet, the top of your swing cannot be that high unless you drop the ball into the swing earlier and or slow down you feet (make steps 1,2and 3 longer). If you make these steps longer you can still keep the same pace it will just take longer to finish the approach.
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#193243 - 01/11/16 01:10 PM Re: How to get more backswing? [Re: spr3wr]
BowlerBill Offline
Team USA Contender

Registered: 09/08/13
Posts: 435
A/S/L: 55/m/Ca
Originally Posted By: spr3wr
Originally Posted By: BowlerBill
Originally Posted By: Dennis Michael
hold ball higher in presentation. Push out to gain more speed. and, lean forward in approach.
e

I've tried to hold the ball higher and push out. These are good tips that help. I haven't tried increasing tilt yet. I'll give that one a shot. Thanks.


Holding the ball higher for a higher backswing doesn't work for most people. It just places the ball into the swing later. As we mention before in your other post. slow down your foot speed. This will allow the ball more time to reach a higher position.

Remember that the swing needs to match the timing of the player.

After looking at videos of you from 1 and 2 yrs ago you haven't changed much. You have fast feet with that said , if you want a higher backswing then you need to hold the ball lower to match up with your footwork. A bowler who gets the ball into the swing early in relation to the footwork will tend to have a higher backswing. Conversely, a bowler who gets the ball into the swing late in relation to the footwork will tend to have a lower backswing.
Timing is the sequencing of the feet, when the ball is put into motion, and the spacing of each step. Usually, the earlier the ball is placed into the swing, the higher the swing can go and still be in the proper timing window.With your fast feet, the top of your swing cannot be that high unless you drop the ball into the swing earlier and or slow down you feet (make steps 1,2and 3 longer). If you make these steps longer you can still keep the same pace it will just take longer to finish the approach.




spr3wr, this is enlightening. I have been concentrating on making the 1st and 2nd steps shorter and slower in an attempt to get better timing.

I don't know why I have fast feet but I do and it affects my game that is for certain. Some days it worse than others.

I've experimented with pushing the ball up as high as I can get in the push away in an attempt to get a pendulum type swing. Some days this works really well. I can feel the back swing being higher and get much more speed on the ball and energy in the pocket. Is this something I should pursue?

I guess change is not as easy as I thought it would be. Thanks for your feedback.
_________________________
Mission X, Shatter, Rhino Pro, Virtual Gravity, Disorder, White Dot, Critical
HG 300 (sanctioned),

HS 805 (250, 300, 255) (non-sanctioned)
746 (267, 257, 222) (sanctioned)

Top
#193247 - 01/11/16 07:07 PM Re: How to get more backswing? [Re: BowlerBill]
spr3wr Offline
USBC Bronze Level Coach

Registered: 08/19/06
Posts: 557
A/S/L: 54/m/MICHIGAN
[/quote]

spr3wr, this is enlightening. I have been concentrating on making the 1st and 2nd steps shorter and slower in an attempt to get better timing.

I don't know why I have fast feet but I do and it affects my game that is for certain. Some days it worse than others.

I've experimented with pushing the ball up as high as I can get in the push away in an attempt to get a pendulum type swing. Some days this works really well. I can feel the back swing being higher and get much more speed on the ball and energy in the pocket. Is this something I should pursue?

I guess change is not as easy as I thought it would be. Thanks for your feedback. [/quote]

If the lanes are dry and you need more speed then yes .

If you slow down the steps, DON'T change when the pushaway starts . I would lower the ball so your wrist is at your belt buckle in the setup. Then start the pushaway at the same time as you do now and don't allow the pushaway to move upwards.Think forwards and drop at the same time this way you can keep your foot speed the same. Then after the ball has dropped into the swing and is behind your right leg you then can tilt forward.

Seems like everything works some days lol.
_________________________
USBC Bronze level Coach
Ritger'S level 1 coach
High game 300 X 2
High series 810
Current ave. 213

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