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#190127 - 01/27/15 06:56 PM How would you handle this situation?
MDLee3 Offline
Bantam

Registered: 03/13/13
Posts: 12
A/S/L: 34/M/Indiana
I have a bowler on one of my teams that has gotten mad and quit in the middle of the 2nd game 3 of the last 4 weeks. It's bad enough that he gets so made, but he's getting mad when he's bowled over his average in the first game each week. For example, he has a 197 average and yesterday he bowled a 201 the first game and then quit after he bowled the 4th frame of the 2nd game so he only got credit for a 53 that game.

We were a team that was competing for the league championship, but his actions have pretty much guaranteed us one loss each week. We don't mind losing so much, but at least want to have a legitimate chance at winning.

Personally, I want to replace this bowler immediately, but that's a problem because there are only 10 or 11 weeks left in the season and everybody that wants to bowl full-time is already doing so. I guarantee that he won't be on my team next year, but what should I do for the rest of this season?

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Registered: Fri Aug 27 2004
Posts: 10100
A/S/L: Mountain View, CA
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#190129 - 01/27/15 11:29 PM Re: How would you handle this situation? [Re: MDLee3]
champ Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 11/30/10
Posts: 2144
A/S/L: 32/M/AZ
I'd say once is pretty inexcusable, but three of the last four is definite grounds for removal. Ten weeks to go is too much time to subject yourself to being in the presence of someone with such a poor attitude.

I know full well that being a 200 average bowler with bigger aspirations can be quite frustrating, but this sort of behavior isn't an acceptable way to vent your frustration. Time to move on.
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#190130 - 01/28/15 12:30 AM Re: How would you handle this situation? [Re: MDLee3]
FuriousSam Offline
Action Bowler

Registered: 09/29/03
Posts: 299
A/S/L: 32/M/Lodi, NJ
Isn't that grounds for sandbagging if he only got 53 on that game and he's averaging 197? Do you know why he's getting upset for bowling over his average?

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#190134 - 01/28/15 01:06 AM Re: How would you handle this situation? [Re: MDLee3]
Dennis Michael Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9814
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
sam, if a bowler doesn't finish a game, every frame is filled with the equivalent of his absent score. So, he doesn't bowl 53.
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#190135 - 01/28/15 07:53 AM Re: How would you handle this situation? [Re: MDLee3]
MDLee3 Offline
Bantam

Registered: 03/13/13
Posts: 12
A/S/L: 34/M/Indiana
I honestly can't say what his problem is. I mean, he's the type of person that if he averages 197, he gets mad if he bowls a 196 and it doesn't even matter what his series is, he'll dwell on the 1 game where he didn't get his average. He gets mad if he hits the pocket and doesn't get a strike. When playing cards during bowling, he'll get mad if anybody at the table has any cards that are better than his. He gets mad at the silly stuff like that, but he isn't mad at us, he just starts on a rant about how he's no good at bowling or he has the worst luck in the world.

I don't know what has changed in the last month though. There would be times before when he'd say something like, "If I leave another pocket 7-10, I'm going home," but he never did even if he ended up leaving another 7-10. Over the last month though, he's bowled well in the games he's bowled so this part of him leaving makes no sense.

In fact, the only thing that could have set him off this week was that he bowled a 201 and was dead last on the team, but that makes no sense either. Our first game Monday, we bowled 236, 235, 217, and 201. The 2nd game, he threw a bad ball and left the big 4 then he got a strike and a spare, then left the 3-6-9-10 and got 3 of them. That was when he came back and said he was going home. He walked right by us and grabbed his stuff and walked out.

Last week, he stayed for the whole league and he didn't bowl very well at all. He had a good last game so he only missed his average by like 20 pins for the day, but that is enough to set him off most of the time.

It's a problem finding a replacement because the people that are on the sub list have no interest in bowling full time. Basically, they want to keep bowling for free. So we would still be stuck paying for his bowling if we get rid of him. Like I said, I want to because he's hurting the team. Even if it wasn't for him leaving early lately, I still wouldn't want him on my team next year because I'm tired of him whining about every little thing that happens to him when none of the rest of us complain about it. We might say something like, "I knew that wasn't a great ball, but I didn't think it deserved that," but then we let it go.

This isn't exactly a new behavior for him either. I mean, the leaving part is, but he's been on my team for 8 years and he's always had this type of attitude, but he had never left before until a month ago. Over that time, his attitude seems to have gotten worse, or at least it appears that way to me. It's changed a lot in the last 2-3 seasons and he's always going on about something during league that has made him angry, but nothing over the last few seasons is anything out of the ordinary for him to complain about.

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#190136 - 01/28/15 08:03 AM Re: How would you handle this situation? [Re: Dennis Michael]
Mkirchie Offline
Hall of Famer Contender

Registered: 01/14/07
Posts: 873
A/S/L: 39/M/New Jersey
Originally Posted By: Dennis Michael
sam, if a bowler doesn't finish a game, every frame is filled with the equivalent of his absent score. So, he doesn't bowl 53.


I checked the rulebook and this is only true if it were a valid reason to not finish the game. Also, the incomplete game does not count to his average.

108b. Without Cause
When a player does not complete a game for reasons other than disability, injury or emergency, the player’s team shall count zero for each remaining frame in the game. (See Rule 118a for average information.)

Commonly Asked Question – Rule 108b.
108b/1 After missing a spare in the fifth frame of the second game, the player gets upset and stops bowling. How do you score the bowler’s second and third game? The team is credited with the actual score for the first five frames bowled and zero for each remaining frames in the second game. For the third game, the team uses the player’s absentee score. In calculating the bowler’s average, only the first game is included in the bowler’s average record.

Mark
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#190137 - 01/28/15 08:53 AM Re: How would you handle this situation? [Re: MDLee3]
Doogie Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 08/31/11
Posts: 354
A/S/L: 37/M/Lincoln, NE
The way you make it sound you would be happier kicking him off of the team and the team splitting his fees for the rest of the league.
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#190140 - 01/28/15 05:07 PM Re: How would you handle this situation? [Re: MDLee3]
MDLee3 Offline
Bantam

Registered: 03/13/13
Posts: 12
A/S/L: 34/M/Indiana
I'd be happier if I wasn't in this situation. If you would have asked me 5 weeks ago, my answer would have been that I just want to finish this year with him and then find a replacement for him for next season.

When he walked out the first time, none of us really knew what to think, but I was pretty mad about it. When he's struggling, he acts like he's the only person that has ever struggled at bowling. He didn't struggle that day though. He hasn't struggled on any of the days he's left early. That is the part that has us puzzled. His first game the other day, he didn't start off so well, but he made a move and finished strong for a 201.

The 2nd game, when he left the big 4 in the 1st frame, it was just a bad ball and he even said that himself, but he didn't seem mad about it. Then a few frames later, he was grabbing his stuff and walking out.

Anyway, the first time he walked out, nothing was really said to him about it. We figured maybe something was going on with his wife or kids that was making him get madder than usual about things. Then he walked out the 2nd time, which was the following week, and I spoke to him privately about it. Basically, I told him that he couldn't be doing that. If he shows up, he needs to finish the night, but if he needs to take time away, we would gladly find a sub. Finding a sub would have been easier since they could have still bowled for free. I also pointed out to him that he made a commitment to the team and the league and that he needs to keep that commitment. I figured this would convince him because he's always complaining about other people that join the league and then they think it's ok to quit after 10 weeks or so. This hasn't been a huge problem in this league, but it has happened more than it should. So the next week, he bowled all 3 games despite the fact that he didn't bowl well. So now, we were more confused because the 2 previous weeks, he'd bowled well and left early, but then he bowled poorly and stayed so we were hoping that my talk with him convinced him that what he was doing was stupid. Then this week, he left early again.

So this next Monday, we will be having a team meeting before league starts. We're all there early enough that we can actually accomplish stuff before practice starts. I'm going to propose that if he leaves early again, he's off the team. We simply can not continue this. That puts the decision squarely on him. If he gets mad about the ultimatum and leaves either before league play starts or during league play, then it's him saying he doesn't want to be part of the team.

The best case scenario for us would be for him to finish the year and go our separate ways next year. If that isn't possible, then we would gladly let him pay for the rest of the year and him sit out. That would only hurt us in a position round and we only have 1 more left so the damage done by him sitting out would be minimal. If that isn't acceptable to him, or if we have to kick him off the team, the paying for his share of the league fees won't be a problem, but at the same time, it's not something that we should have to do. It would be entirely different if he had an emergency come up and couldn't finish the season or if he got moved to a different shift at work so he couldn't bowl, but not for him having a bad attitude.

BTW, the first time he walked out on us a month ago wasn't the first time he'd walked out during a bowling event, but it is the first time he's walked out on a team event. I believe it was 2 years ago, he walked out of the City Tournament during the Singles event, but spending the money on yourself and then quitting is a lot different than walking out on a team that's depending on you.

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#190573 - 02/23/15 10:21 PM Re: How would you handle this situation? [Re: MDLee3]
Odie8654 Offline
Junior Master

Registered: 02/01/15
Posts: 34
A/S/L: 55/F/California
MDLee3 - sweetie, can they do a vacant for his spot? Set average is used for any team spot that is missing a player for the season, as some teams may not have a full roster. Possible or doesn't the league use vacants? At least that way you have a steady average for that spot and nobody is stuck footing the guys bill either. Just a thought?

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#190597 - 02/25/15 07:56 AM Re: How would you handle this situation? [Re: MDLee3]
MDLee3 Offline
Bantam

Registered: 03/13/13
Posts: 12
A/S/L: 34/M/Indiana
Odie-That's what we've done the last 2 weeks. Generally speaking, our league doesn't allow vacants for extended periods unless there is a legitimate emergency.

We had our team meeting that one week and he seemed ok with what we told him. Two weeks later, he didn't show up and never got ahold of anybody. I saw him at Walmart later that week and asked him what happened. He acted like it wasn't a big deal. Under normal circumstances, it probably wouldn't be, but with his actions lately, it is a very big deal. So I told him not to show up the next Monday and I'd get back to him about what we decided.

At the next league session, I went and spoke to the officers and explained the situation to them. They agreed to call a meeting, where we informed the team captains what was going on and requested that we be allowed to bowl with a vacant since it didn't look like we'd be able to find a sub. The captains voted and approved our request on the condition that the money was still paid.

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