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#180581 - 08/25/13 07:56 PM NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH
rrb6699 (RayRay) Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 06/07/13
Posts: 513
A/S/L: Single/male/FL
Hey,

Almost had a 300 last night (sat) in a local tourn. The new grip i'm using is very consistent, but, that one hang cost me the 300. Every strike was an 'instant carry' no doubt about it strike. Just the one shot that hung and left a 3-6.

I have changed my grip last week (that is, the way i'm holding the ball not the ball grip) and now my thumb pitch seems like i need it adjusted. I plan on consulting my ball driller and finding out what i need to do. i hang on the side of my thumb when i do hang. gripping the ball this way insures a clean release for me, but, i have to grip the ball with my thumb 2/3rds of the way in the ball or it will hang.

any ideas which way i should pitch my thumb when i'm hanging on the side? To clarify, looking down on a bowling ball with fingers up i hang on the right side of the thumb hole. I'm thinking i need to pitch the ball away from the palm laterally. i dont think i need to change the under or reverse unless i want to. I plan on using 1/8th under on my next drill because i threw a friends (the ball driller's ball actually) which has 1/4 under and 0 lateral. i threw that ball well so i know i can use the 1/4 under but don't want to go more than 1/8th under next drill.

On this ball the thumb hole is 1/8th reverse and 0 lateral pitch.

any help is appreciated on what to do to adjust this thumb.

RR
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#180583 - 08/25/13 10:52 PM Re: NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH [Re: rrb6699 (RayRay)]
Dennis Michael Offline
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#180584 - 08/25/13 11:28 PM Re: NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH [Re: rrb6699 (RayRay)]
Dave800 Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 280
A/S/L: Burbs of Milwaukee
I just went through a grip change, mostly thumb pitch.
Had way to much reverse and overall span was to short

Anyways, the point being that you have to find someone who knows what they are doing, understands your thumb flexibility and drills accordingly.

Im getting the ball through the heads better than ever and my thumb pressure is now much less
An eye opener for sure
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#180585 - 08/26/13 06:44 AM Re: NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH [Re: Dave800]
rrb6699 (RayRay) Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 06/07/13
Posts: 513
A/S/L: Single/male/FL
Yeah i agree. the driller i use is highly recommended and a good player. i like using him because we have similar games to a point but similar tween styles. I happened upon this grip technique through many hours of practice lately looking for anything i can key on to improve consistency. i think i found it. I can show my Pro Shop guy what i'm doing easily enough to confirm what we need to do with my thumb pitch. the only unknown is whether or not i need to modify finger pitches. i will look over the Jayhawk link. thanks for that.

rr
_________________________
Twnr-RH
300(13) 290(36) 280(30)
Ser- 1072-4g 867-3g
Tilt: 15, AoR- 65, PAP: 4 3/4ovr, 3/4up,
Sp:15.5 avg
Alpha Crux-15#
Guru Mastr-15#
Sinister-15#
Grenade-16#
Quantum Violet-16#
Wht Dot-16#
MoRich Frenzy-15#
Multi wins/Top 5 Finshes-Scr&Hcp events

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#180586 - 08/26/13 08:32 AM Re: NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH [Re: rrb6699 (RayRay)]
Joe Bowler Offline
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Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 3824
A/S/L: 50s/M/MD
A one out of twelve shot intermittent hang would be tough to diagnose without seeing up close how the ball fits, how it comes off your hand, and what you are doing with your new grip. It's great that you have a local driller that can help.

Btw, what is the new grip technique you are using? It sounds like a winner.
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#180587 - 08/26/13 08:35 AM Re: NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH [Re: rrb6699 (RayRay)]
sk8shorty01 Offline
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Registered: 01/05/09
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A/S/L: 30/M/Merritt Island, FL
I have a question, did you say you are only putting your thumb 2/3 of the way into the thumb hole and then holding on to the ball?
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#180610 - 08/26/13 10:42 PM Re: NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH [Re: sk8shorty01]
rrb6699 (RayRay) Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 06/07/13
Posts: 513
A/S/L: Single/male/FL
To answer both of the questions. as for the 2/3rds thumb, yes, because (to answer question two about the grip) i am doing 2 things: 1) i'm pushing the base of the fingers into the ball throughout the entire swing and 2) I am making sure my thumb is completely flat in the ball.

The same thing occurs with a Vise glove, but, i cannot wear them and why should i if i can hold the ball the same way the glove positions your hand? In my mind that is what i'm thinking. So, just put the glove on and it does the same thing - holds the thumb 'up' from the ball and puts the weight of the ball on the base pads of your ring and mid fingers. try it with and without a glove and let me know how it goes.

By holding the ball this way the ball is locked in the 10'Oclock position (for me) - it may be different for each person. AND when i deliver the ball it releases at the same point without thinking. That's what i have been doing all this practice for I hope.

But, if i put my thumb in all the way i have a big loft on the ball because it hangs. maybe if i need to loft the ball i can use that but, i have a good loft shot when i need it already.

that one shot that i hung up on i remember having trouble getting my hand situated in the ball. i took the shot anyway thinking it would not matter and i should have waited until i did get my grip right no matter how long it took. i guess if i were a true elite bowler i would have recognized that and maybe should have gone as far as putting the ball back down and starting over.

BTW. i went up today and bowled two games (one step/two step drill again the first game) then shot a 258 the next game (all i had time for 2 games). If i had carried one of the 10 pins it would have been 279 so, looks like i may be on to something (at least on THS) for me. hopefully on all conditions.

The true test will be this weekend in a 10k tournament with a modified Chameleon pattern - maybe dual lane patterns down. i will have to be ready for anything but will be doing the same grip technique.

So, I guess my general question is if i'm hanging on one side of my thumb hole do i pitch the thumb away from the side of the hole I'm hanging on? I definitely do not want to make the lip of that side of the hole more pronounced right?

rr
_________________________
Twnr-RH
300(13) 290(36) 280(30)
Ser- 1072-4g 867-3g
Tilt: 15, AoR- 65, PAP: 4 3/4ovr, 3/4up,
Sp:15.5 avg
Alpha Crux-15#
Guru Mastr-15#
Sinister-15#
Grenade-16#
Quantum Violet-16#
Wht Dot-16#
MoRich Frenzy-15#
Multi wins/Top 5 Finshes-Scr&Hcp events

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#180617 - 08/27/13 06:38 AM Re: NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH [Re: rrb6699 (RayRay)]
Joe Bowler Offline
2x Virtual League Champion

Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 3824
A/S/L: 50s/M/MD
RayRay, thanks for sharing your new grip technique. The natural thing for most bowlers is to bend their thumb in the ball to grip it. Keeping the thumb straight promotes a more relaxed grip and consistent release. Of course, the ball has to fit first.

This is just a guess without actually seeing your hand in the ball, but it sounds more like your span needs to be adjusted, rather than your thumb pitches. Later, after you can insert your entire thumb in the ball while keeping it straight, it would be possible to assess if any pitch changes are required.
_________________________
USBC (2008-2016):
300s: 9
800s: 7
House: 239
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Spares: WD

Internet advice is offered free, as is, at your own risk.

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#180626 - 08/27/13 01:33 PM Re: NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH [Re: Joe Bowler]
sk8shorty01 Offline
Virtual League Champion x2

Registered: 01/05/09
Posts: 5163
A/S/L: 30/M/Merritt Island, FL
Originally Posted By: Joe Bowler
...
This is just a guess without actually seeing your hand in the ball, but it sounds more like your span needs to be adjusted, rather than your thumb pitches. Later, after you can insert your entire thumb in the ball while keeping it straight, it would be possible to assess if any pitch changes are required.



I agree, if you cannot bury your thumb in the ball then there is definitely something wrong. It might be span or my other thought is that it could need a pinch more bevel on the thumb, depending on where the ball hangs on your thumb itself.

Either way, I would get your fit evaluated and see what can be done to fix the thumb hang issue that you are having.
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#180631 - 08/27/13 08:18 PM Re: NEED HELP WITH THUMB PITCH [Re: sk8shorty01]
rrb6699 (RayRay) Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 06/07/13
Posts: 513
A/S/L: Single/male/FL
I have already consulted one pro and will talk to the one who will be drilling my ball, but, first i am going to take a ball i use solely for grip changes to see if pitching the thumb is going to do it.

I guess i left out some information you guys need to know here. First of all i CAN insert my thumb all the way and my span is comfortable. However, NOW that i switched to using this grip technique, IF i put my thumb all the way in my thumb hole, the ball hangs where i previously described to begin this thread.

So, you see i am at a quandry of sorts because gripping the ball this way makes my span too long - ? Even though I did have a fitting just a week before I changed my grip technique. I believe my least expensive alternative to test this theory out is to drill out a thumb and pay 10.00 to slug it and change the pitch (instant gratification).

Once it do that and confirm that pitching the thumb away from the palm works I will drill the ball. otherwise i need to be re-fitted before i drill a ball radically different than i'm used to.

agree or disagree?

rr

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