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#158654 - 11/23/11 01:23 PM Re: How do I get more revs? [Re: haywardmike]
10PinGaloot Offline
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Registered: 05/19/09
Posts: 2094
A/S/L: 65/m/ Woodburn, OR
Originally Posted By: haywardmike
.... PBA card.... "stroker".... a no thumb release....difficult because I had high performance aggressive coverstock ....so far, so good!


GREAT STUFF!

Welcome to the Community, Mike! Hey, glad to have you here. If anyone should be able to help us hackers, it's an ex-PBA guy!

You might want to introduce yourself over at "New Member Intros & Tech Help", but if not, welcome. And post a lot!
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#158676 - 11/23/11 09:30 PM Re: How do I get more revs? [Re: Deano79]
PowerBall Offline
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Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 169
A/S/L: 36/M/Ca
UGH so confused after doing research.

If the standard starting and release position is a consistent 10 (for thumb) and 4 (for middle finger I guess? 5 for ring?)

Some people are saying an 11 and 5/6, up to a 12 and 6/7, up to a 1 and 7/8 would actually load the ball more so that if I kept my fingers in that position and then turn them to 10 and 4 at the release it would create more revs...

while OTHER sources say that a 9 oclock thumb creates more hook/revs while a 12 oclock is a straight ball..

I can see how the 12 oclock position would work for a straight ball but I would leave it in a 12 and not turn my hand at all..

so can anyone sort this all out for me please?


Now, if I were to use the 1 oclock thumb position (fingers at 7/8), do I start at 10 and 4/5 and then rotate my wrist OR do I pivot my wrist to the left?

This video seems to show Wes using a 1 and 7/8,



is this painful at all ?

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#158678 - 11/23/11 10:07 PM Re: How do I get more revs? [Re: Deano79]
metguy Offline
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Registered: 03/12/11
Posts: 1108
A/S/L: 46/m/waverly iowa
It is hard to explain where your hand should be (through the release) until you understand what that particular position is doing for you. Its all about "Ball Momentum".?...

When talking revs generating, the thumb is the brakes that reduces revs. A relaxed grip and properly fitted ball eliminate that so now its all about finger position (and free-armswing).

Finger position is dictated by how much revs you are trying to acheive. That can be decided by a few factors. Ball projection, follow through whether it be the continuation of a free armswing or an accelerated follow through, and ball momentum.

You can throw a high performance ball completely straight even though your thumb is at 11 and your fingers are at 5 IF you start releasing the ball with your thumb at 9 and fingers at 3 because you have created ball momentum. When you refer to Wes and his hand position he actually cocks his wrist to create just that.

Some are talking a "Fixed wrist" position while others are talking "Finish or start" positions. That does get confusing sometimes. Just remember this. If you want to pick up a heavy table you have to get your fingers under it. If you want to flip the table over (fast) you get under it and then around the side of it (FAST). Anything less will give you less.
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#158684 - 11/23/11 11:00 PM Re: How do I get more revs? [Re: metguy]
PowerBall Offline
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Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 169
A/S/L: 36/M/Ca
cock his wrist? like as in cup? Or pivot it to the left?

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#158686 - 11/23/11 11:40 PM Re: How do I get more revs? [Re: PowerBall]
B-Hammer Offline
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Registered: 04/19/09
Posts: 1805
A/S/L: 30/M/Bellingham WA
Originally Posted By: TidalKnight
cock his wrist? like as in cup? Or pivot it to the left?


Pivot to the left, or make your arm and hand like the number 7.

Remember you can't force revs, your muscles aren't strong enough or fast enough to force the ball to spin, what it can do though is hold the ball in position (contract) and then extend (relax)quickly. That's what Wes is doing in that video, he's keeping his hand inside (cocked) until the last second then just releases the ball. It's where the yo-yo analogy comes from, because when you use a yo-yo you just flick it, you don't force a yo-yo down.

This video is ok showing someone just holding their hand is a strong position until the last moment and then just releasing the ball into the lanes.

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#158697 - 11/24/11 02:58 AM Re: How do I get more revs? [Re: B-Hammer]
PowerBall Offline
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Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 169
A/S/L: 36/M/Ca
Originally Posted By: B-Hammer
Originally Posted By: TidalKnight
cock his wrist? like as in cup? Or pivot it to the left?


Pivot to the left, or make your arm and hand like the number 7.

Remember you can't force revs, your muscles aren't strong enough or fast enough to force the ball to spin, what it can do though is hold the ball in position (contract) and then extend (relax)quickly. That's what Wes is doing in that video, he's keeping his hand inside (cocked) until the last second then just releases the ball. It's where the yo-yo analogy comes from, because when you use a yo-yo you just flick it, you don't force a yo-yo down.

This video is ok showing someone just holding their hand is a strong position until the last moment and then just releasing the ball into the lanes.


Interesting! Good thing you put it as "make it like 7".. that makes sense.
What's interesting is last night when trying to figure this out, I did that but thought that can't be it, so I rotated my wrist instead thinking that was it.
So I guess your thumb and fingers are still in the 10 and 4/5 position just pointed at a different clock?

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#158698 - 11/24/11 03:24 AM Re: How do I get more revs? [Re: B-Hammer]
PowerBall Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 169
A/S/L: 36/M/Ca
Ok and just to be clear, is it a 7 with my palm facing me? Like if I held my hand up in front of my face with my palm pointing towards my face.. it's the hand to the left right?

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#158700 - 11/24/11 04:29 AM Re: How do I get more revs? [Re: Deano79]
B-Hammer Offline
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Registered: 04/19/09
Posts: 1805
A/S/L: 30/M/Bellingham WA

Richard Shockley's Videos might help you visualize what is going on.




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