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#130704 - 06/25/10 07:36 PM Need some help on layout.
Michael James Offline
Bantam

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 14
A/S/L: Alabama
I got my ball drilled a few weeks ago. Got my spare ball drilled first and got the pap off of it for my main ball. I don't know what my pap or anything is, I didn't ask and he didn't tell me.

But I am absolutely hating the ball reaction I'm getting. I included a pic of the layout. Going by this it looks like he used the maximum hook and arc high track layout. He asked me what kind of reaction I wanted before he drilled it and I told him I put decent lift and rotation on it so I didn't need a lot of hook, that I like to play down and in, 1st to 2nd arrow straight across. But I can't control this ball and can't stand the line I have to play, this is on THS and I've gone in and bowled on fresh oil right when the center opened and it's the same line no matter what.

I have to stand far left, throw hard over 3rd arrow to 1-2nd board and most of the time it's coming back high dead on the head pin. After 2 games I'm tired from having to put so much zip on it. The driller told me that that down and in shot isn't gonna happen, everything is too angular now.

Is that true? Should I have the Pro Shop re-drill to a different pattern or should I just find an adjustment to make this layout work for me? I included a pic of about what my line looks like with this ball(C - System 3.5). After bowling today I just got so frustrated and used my spare ball (Columbia Blue Dot) that was drilled flat, nothing on it and was able to play the line I want to play, straight down the 1st arrow and went right into the pocket.

I don't know how to approach the driller cause he's a USBC Silver Coach so he should know more than me, but I just can't work with the ball the way it is. If I'm off a board it's in the gutter.


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_________________________
Brunswick C (system) 3.5 #16
Columbia 300 Blue Dot #16
Etonic ESS Interchangeable RH
--------------------------------
Since returning to the game:
Current avg: 189
Last series: 680 (223,220,237)
High game: 267

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Legend

Registered: Fri Aug 27 2004
Posts: 10100
A/S/L: Mountain View, CA
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#130705 - 06/25/10 07:43 PM Re: Need some help on layout. [Re: Michael James]
Calvin Pistorio Offline
State Champion Contender

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 6283
A/S/L: 32/m/maryland
That's a pretty strong ball, probably too strong for many bowlers on a THS. On a little heavier and longer pattern it might be able to be played down the second arrow but at most centers to play first arrow would need to be plastic or an entry level ball and that's might be a bit iffy with any reactive. Maybe a urethane but there is no guarantee especially if you have a good amount of revs.
_________________________
Calvin's Highs
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HG:300
HS:763

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#130706 - 06/25/10 07:53 PM Re: Need some help on layout. [Re: Calvin Pistorio]
Michael James Offline
Bantam

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 14
A/S/L: Alabama
I was thinking the length, or length and back end layout might tone it down enough where I can at least play a straighter line but I don't know much about the new technologies. Just got back into bowling after a 15 yr hiatus. And I got to say it's more than a bit frustrating. Is there anything I can do to take some hook off of it where I can slow down my swing to a natural swing and keep my same release, I think I get a good amount of revs on it. Haven't had anyone with me yet to count. I used to play 2nd arrow to crossing 2nd arrow to 2-3rd board, so this is quite a change for me, and getting annoyed that my high game is a 249 so far but that was with 10 strikes all going brooklyn.

Or should I just shelve the ball and get something weaker. I don't have a lot of money so I'd really like to make this ball work for now, if possible.


Edited by Michael James (06/25/10 07:54 PM)
_________________________
Brunswick C (system) 3.5 #16
Columbia 300 Blue Dot #16
Etonic ESS Interchangeable RH
--------------------------------
Since returning to the game:
Current avg: 189
Last series: 680 (223,220,237)
High game: 267

Top
#130707 - 06/25/10 09:15 PM Re: Need some help on layout. [Re: Michael James]
Calvin Pistorio Offline
State Champion Contender

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 6283
A/S/L: 32/m/maryland
Most of the balls reaction is the coverstock. It comes factory at 4000 micro-pad which is similar to 4000 Abralon. Maybe some extender polish or learning to reduce revs and axis rotation might help but unless you get more oil and a longer oil pattern this ball is going to hook. I suggest learning to bowl outside of your "comfort zone."
_________________________
Calvin's Highs
Career
HG:300
HS:763

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#130709 - 06/25/10 10:22 PM Re: Need some help on layout. [Re: Michael James]
jwill Offline
Action Bowler

Registered: 09/27/09
Posts: 203
A/S/L: 25/M/Jax, FL
Originally Posted By: Michael James

Or should I just shelve the ball and get something weaker. I don't have a lot of money so I'd really like to make this ball work for now, if possible.


Yea, you got a ball that was made for the purpose of reacting to friction QUICK in heavier oil. I think there is a member on here by the name of Mike Maloney who has one and plays a straighter line with it. He has a video on youtube. I think a Urethane ball would suit your style well. However, if you don't want to buy another ball you could get it plugged and re-drilled or learn how to play the deep inside line. I could've used something like this with the amount of oil I encountered tonight!

_________________________
Current Arsenal

Virtual Gravity
Inferno
Avalanche Urethane
Toy Story Viz-A-Ball

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#130712 - 06/25/10 11:39 PM Re: Need some help on layout. [Re: jwill]
Michael James Offline
Bantam

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 14
A/S/L: Alabama
Originally Posted By: jwill
Originally Posted By: Michael James

Or should I just shelve the ball and get something weaker. I don't have a lot of money so I'd really like to make this ball work for now, if possible.


Yea, you got a ball that was made for the purpose of reacting to friction QUICK in heavier oil. I think there is a member on here by the name of Mike Maloney who has one and plays a straighter line with it. He has a video on youtube. I think a Urethane ball would suit your style well. However, if you don't want to buy another ball you could get it plugged and re-drilled or learn how to play the deep inside line. I could've used something like this with the amount of oil I encountered tonight!



Thanks, the league I bowl in gives me unlimited bowling M-F so thankfully I got lots of time to work on things. I came across this video of the c - system's reaction:


And Brian's line seems pretty similar to mine except it's all about 5 boards left, he plays across center arrow to about 1st. I might try that. His rotation seems to be about how mine does. Maybe that will help keep the ball in the oil longer. Just with the way the ball has been reacting I wanted it as far away from the pocket as possible when it reacted. And maybe work on my back swing, it comes about parallel to the floor at it's peak.

Although all of that seems to lean towards cranker and it just seems most of the time crankers have a hard time with consistency. I wanted to be more of my style 15 yrs ago which was a straighter line but with the lift and rotation I do with the new technologies might not happen. I did notice in your video that he did change the surface to 2000-1000 which is duller I believe. In my case I might have to polish it.

I love the ball, don't get me wrong. The pin reaction is insane. And trying to control it is just as insane. After 15 yrs I found out I still got my accuracy, just got to find the line with this beast. Even tho I'm just getting back in the groove I think I'm gonna try this on some PBA patterns just to see how it does. The center I go to does some of the PBA pats for open play sometimes.
_________________________
Brunswick C (system) 3.5 #16
Columbia 300 Blue Dot #16
Etonic ESS Interchangeable RH
--------------------------------
Since returning to the game:
Current avg: 189
Last series: 680 (223,220,237)
High game: 267

Top
#130733 - 06/26/10 07:45 AM Re: Need some help on layout. [Re: Michael James]
CoachJim Offline
USBC Silver Coach

Registered: 09/19/06
Posts: 4665
A/S/L: Reston, Virginia USA
The ball is one of the strongest on the market and is not for playing the line you want on a house pattern because there is nowhere near enough oil to get the ball down the lane from the second arrow to the gutter on a house pattern.

You may have better luck with the reaction on pba patterns, but you will not have any room for error on them either, miss right and the ball goes right, miss left and the ball goes left.

The drilling pattern is set up to have the ball spread it's hook through a long period of time and to have a high flare and heavy roll.

If your driller is a silver level coach I suggest taking some lessons from him as the game has changed greatly in the last 20 or so years.


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#130746 - 06/26/10 04:40 PM Re: Need some help on layout. [Re: CoachJim]
Joe Bowler Offline
2x Virtual League Champion

Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 3824
A/S/L: 50s/M/MD
The plastic Blue Dot was a great choice for a spare ball. But, if a plastic ball is hooking enough to play your favorite line, you are unlikely to find any resin ball, regardless of layout, to play the same line.

Today's equipment is much stronger than 10-15 years ago. I would suggest keeping the ball as is and learn to play deeper inside. On a house shot, you should find more oil in the center of the lane. Starting from your favorite line, try moving inside in increments of feet 2 boards, and target 1 board, That should help you get lined up quickly.
_________________________
USBC (2008-2016):
300s: 9
800s: 7
House: 239
Sport: 210

PBA (2014-2015): $850

Heavy: Nano, HyperCell, Eternal Cell
Medium: IQ Tour, Tour SiC, Tag
Light: Spare+, Tank, Rebel Tank
Spares: WD

Internet advice is offered free, as is, at your own risk.

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#130753 - 06/26/10 07:52 PM Re: Need some help on layout. [Re: Joe Bowler]
jwill Offline
Action Bowler

Registered: 09/27/09
Posts: 203
A/S/L: 25/M/Jax, FL
I think two go-arounds in the polisher (10min total) will do you some justice. I did that to my Evil Siege when I bowled at Bowl America and it held the dry conditions very nicely. The C-System series reminds me of the Quantums from back in the day for some reason. I want a CFT v4.5 though, my driller said he would be getting some in sometime next week before the release. I just don't have the $189.99 to spend for it at this time.
_________________________
Current Arsenal

Virtual Gravity
Inferno
Avalanche Urethane
Toy Story Viz-A-Ball

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#130754 - 06/26/10 08:12 PM Re: Need some help on layout. [Re: jwill]
Calvin Pistorio Offline
State Champion Contender

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 6283
A/S/L: 32/m/maryland
Originally Posted By: jwill
I think two go-arounds in the polisher (10min total) will do you some justice.


If you are talking about Lustre King. Don't do it. These are rarely maintained in good working order and that is technology for plastic and urethane, not the newer reactives.
_________________________
Calvin's Highs
Career
HG:300
HS:763

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