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#126226 - 04/23/10 12:02 PM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: B-Hammer]
Dennis Michael Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9809
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
Being an officer for a few years in our league, if you aren't, you would be surprised how many times the local USBC has been consulted on rules. We have to call them 3-4 times a year, and they were not minor things left to interpretation.

We have gotten legal opinions on certain rule changes, and the security of lost funds is worth the cost of entry.
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Legend

Registered: Fri Aug 27 2004
Posts: 10100
A/S/L: Mountain View, CA
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#126228 - 04/23/10 12:28 PM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: ecub]
Badam Offline
League Bowler

Registered: 03/26/10
Posts: 81
A/S/L: 39/Male/Indiana, USA
Originally Posted By: ecub
The nice thing is, you can see your progress on the USBC website. If you do happen to roll a 300, 11 strikes in a row, 800 series, and I think a 900 series, it will be shown on the USBC website. It's allot nicer to brag about it to your friends or your bowling buddies. Otherwise, you would have to carry around a printout of your achievement.

FYI, a book average is your average in the USBC member books, which can also be looked up at bowl.com.


How extensively does USBC track individual bowler statistics? Do they only track major achievements like 300's, 800's, and book averages? Or, do they track every score of every sanctioned game that you bowl? If you drop out for a few years, do you lose your stats/book average? Or, can you establish a book average, then miss a few seasons and come back bowl a tournament/league and still find a book average from years ago?
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#126232 - 04/23/10 01:32 PM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: Badam]
ecub Offline
High Roller

Registered: 10/23/09
Posts: 342
A/S/L: 44/m/usa (IL)
I'm an officer of the board in our mixed league and an active captain in 2 leagues and this is what I've known/seen...

Originally Posted By: Badam
How extensively does USBC track individual bowler statistics? Do they only track major achievements like 300's, 800's, and book averages? Or, do they track every score of every sanctioned game that you bowl?

I don't think they do individual stats. I know the secretary turns in the achievement score to USBC. I doubt USBC actually track individually scores. It's up to the individual. There's too much data to collect. It is a good question, which I'll send an email to USBC to find out.

I'm not sure how long USBC keeps the stats. I did look up a person on our league, who past away around 2004, and he still has his book average. I don't know if they do any type of purging of old data.

As far as leagues, I'm not sure what the league rule is, but I know that the secretary on our Men's league looks at the book average for the past 3 years. You may have to ask your secretary. We had a guy who hadn't bowled in over a year, and his book average was used from that last time it was recorded.

Regarding a tourny, I've gone to a few local ones and they go by, I think, 5 years.


Edited by ecub (04/23/10 01:33 PM)
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#126247 - 04/23/10 06:06 PM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: ecub]
Calvin Pistorio Offline
State Champion Contender

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 6283
A/S/L: 32/m/maryland
USBC keeps track of individuals' Honor Scores that are turned as well as other scores that earn you an award, since they are a one per a year deal. They tried to make everything once in a lifetime but quickly changed their mind.
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#126250 - 04/23/10 08:24 PM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: Calvin Pistorio]
Atochabsh Offline
USBC Bronze Coach

Registered: 02/13/01
Posts: 6567
A/S/L: 50/F/California
The Special Achievement awards are only kept within the computer system of the local association (if they input everyone). USBC and the Bowling Museum track the honor awards (as well as the local assoc.).

Erin

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#126259 - 04/24/10 04:48 AM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: Atochabsh]
Sevens Offline
Bracket Donor

Registered: 02/25/09
Posts: 165
A/S/L: 24/m/mn
Originally Posted By: Atochabsh
well besides the above, USBC also has rules as to who can hold an officer position and who cannot and how many of them can be on one team. So you dont' get one family controlling the entire league by virtue of officer votes if they even take votes. Of course non sanctioned leagues can be total dictatorships. No recourse. Rules can be changed half way through the league, league fees can be changed arbitrarily. People can be eliminated from a league based on "I don't like him/her". No recourse.

No a very important thing. USBC offers bonding and security for league funds. If the league funds were to be stolen and proper procedure taken USBC covers it. In a non sanctioned league there's nothing to keep the officers from just keeping the money and not paying out. Or saying "I lost it, someone broke into my car, house, briefcase, ect........" without somewhere to go with that.

USBC sanctioned leagues give you an official average with which you can go to nearly every tournament and bowl. Without an official average you are out of luck if you want to bowl.

But the main issue to me is that the controlling force behind the league politics are limited with USBC sancitioning.

Erin


Wow,you certainly illustrate the absolute worse that can happem. Every league I have bowled in has had no problems whatsoever and every is very laid back.

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#126267 - 04/24/10 09:45 AM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: Sevens]
Dennis Michael Offline
Virtual League Champion

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 9809
A/S/L: M/Barrington, Ill
The USBC does other "behind the scenes" things also, like equipment certification and setting ball specifications. They test every ball before it is released to ensure it meets standards. And, they calculate the rg and diff for accurate publication.

Otherwise we would go back to the acetone soaked balls with soft covers. Ball certification for tournaments is another thing that they do. Their studies on balls have led to many advancements as well.

Don't view them as "Big Brother". They actually perform a valuable function for the sport. And, they did write the rule book.
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#126273 - 04/24/10 10:19 AM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: Dennis Michael]
aoiten Offline
Legend

Registered: 03/03/10
Posts: 1415
A/S/L: amerika ni sunde iru
I read that the JBT isn't happy with the USBC. What other organisations sanction leagues in the USA?

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#126290 - 04/24/10 03:18 PM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: aoiten]
ecub Offline
High Roller

Registered: 10/23/09
Posts: 342
A/S/L: 44/m/usa (IL)
Originally Posted By: aoiten
I read that the JBT isn't happy with the USBC. What other organisations sanction leagues in the USA?


This is what I've read regarding JBT & USBC...
Quote:
With the start of the 2006-07 season, the Junior Bowlers Tour and almost every large tournament group in the country has elected not to have their events USBC-certified. The USBC now requires that all certified events deposit their scholarship money with them. This would cost the JBT scholarship fund a huge amount of interest, based on their "administrative fees" and their investing practices. The JBT would lose the Challenge Tournament, the Masters and some other events that are funded by the interest earned throughout the year. We are not willing to sacrifice those events.


Are there issues your having with the USBC?
_________________________
EQUIPMENT:
Hammer 1st Blood 15# (@1500 Polish)
Hammer Taboo 15# (@2000 Polish)
Hammer Taboo Blue/Silver 15# (@4000)
Storm Natural Pearl 15# (@4000)

PAP: 5 3/4 right 1/4 up
Ball Speed: Mid 15-16 (Power Tweener)

THS: 207
HGS: 279
HSS: 734

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#126291 - 04/24/10 03:26 PM Re: Sanctioned or not? [Re: ecub]
aoiten Offline
Legend

Registered: 03/03/10
Posts: 1415
A/S/L: amerika ni sunde iru
Originally Posted By: ecub


Are there issues your having with the USBC?


I don't have any personal issues with the USBC. I'm just curious if there are alternatives that are still "official."

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