i'm just beginning to use the arrows. i used to, and actually sometimes still do, look down just over the foul line where i would release the ball during the approach up to the release. i'm used to seeing my hand release the ball. this way, i can see the direction of the ball on my release. it has worked for me using a straight ball. it also works on my new ball that hooks but i have a problem adjusting.

if i stand on the first dot, do a straight approach and have the ball roll on the first arrow, my ball consistently ends on the 1-2 pocket when it hooks. i'm right handed. where is the best place to start my approach to have the ball hit the 1-3 pocket?

thanks.

The amount you move depends entirely on lane conditions. Try moving 3 boards left and throwing over the first arrow, if that's not enough move 2 more, etc... If you move 3 and it's now not making it to the pocket (hitting the 3-6) move back a board or two. Just keep your target the same and move a couple boards right or left. Think of the first arrow as your balls fulcrum, you move left, the ball will end up more right at the pins, you move right, the ball will end up move left. Use this same technique for spares too.
Hope that helps!
Jay

thanks snitgts.

i see some stand somewhere in the middle, some somewhere on the right. for the amount of hook my ball generates, should i stay on the right? or it doesn't really matter as long as the ball hits the 1-3 pocket?

A general rule of thumb is a 7-9 board spread between the inside of your left foot (right hander) and your target at the arrows. Be carefull when you say first dot, because some approaches have five dots & some seven; It would be more accurate to state the board number you target with your left foot.

It really doesn't matter where you start as long as the ball makes the 1-3 pocket, but it sounds like you bowl "down and in", so the right side of the lane is where you want to be for that style. Basically you start out by the right side gutter (for righty's) and throw the ball inward towards the area of the 3 or 6 pins (depending on how much hook you have), the amount of hook you ball generates should then bring it into the 1-3 pocket.

Just remember, keep aiming for that first arrow and move left to make the ball hit farther right or move right to get the ball to hit farther left. If you still can't find the pocket, try moving to the left maybe 5-10 boards and aim for the second arrow. Just keep moving around until you find the pocket.

The people starting in different areas of the lane are bowling different styles. People starting all the way to the left are generally crankers, they usually have very high rev rates on their balls and get the most hook. Lane conditions have the most effect on them. People starting in the middle of the lane generally are strokers, they have medium rev rates and a moderate amount of hook on their balls. Lane conditions effect them less then crankers, but more then your group. People starting on the right of the lane throw down and in style, they have the lowest rev rates and the least hook of the three. Lane conditions should have little effect on your ball, but you might still need to move a couple boards left or right due to conditions or as the night goes on and the lanes break down to find the pocket. Their are also bowlers that are "tweeners" that bowl somewhere in-between two of the styles. Personally I have learned how to bowl many styles, down and in, stroker, and tweener. I start as a stroker, but depending on the lanes I might go to down and in or tweener.

Hope that helps!
Jay

thanks big mack and snitgts. sorry i actually meant that my right foot is on the 1st dot, not the left. the 1st dot is aligned with the 1st arrow.

it's already very close to the gutter so i think i need move to the 2nd arrow and probably have my right foot 3 boards left of 2nd dot.

sorry i have not gotten into using board numbers. still not familiar with them. this is all new to me.

if the 1st dot is on board 5, the center of my right foot could be on board 6. so the ball really starts on the 5th board, roll over the 1st arrow, still staying on the 5th board, and still hits the 1-2 pocket when it hooks.

i am thinking of trying to reduce ball spin to reduce the hook, but i think the more the spin, the better the pin reaction would be.

Here's something to consider:

From your ankle on your slide foot to the center of the ball is about 8 boards. So if you want the ball to go down the lane straight, you're going to want to slide 8 boards from your target. If you want the ball to go out a little, you're going to have to slide further to the right.

If you're standing on the first dot and sliding about there, and hitting the first arrow, that means you're pointing the ball at the pocket and you're really not letting the ball hook.

What kind of ball do you have? A good ball drilled properly with an asymetrical core will hook on its own, so you won't have to "spin" it. It will also be a very consistant hook for you. Generally speaking, some hook is good for pin reaction. You want the ball to be rolling with the lane and have that roll drive the ball thru the pins for max carry. It's kind of hard to explain, but I'll try.

Consider that the Earth is your bowling ball. The axis of rotation is the north and south poles. The poles aren't straight up and down though, it's tilted about 15 degrees or so, that's why we have the 4 seasons. This is called axis tilt. When you bowl a hook, you are throwing the ball straight down the lane, but your ball is rotating along an axis that is tilted compared to the direction it's traveling. It will slide thru the oiled part of the lane, but when it hits the back 1/3rd, the lanes become dry and the tilted rotation of the ball pushes it in the direction of the rotation. That's how you get hook! You want the ball to be moving in the exact same direction as the rotation of the ball when it hits the pocket. This will cause the ball to drive thru the pocket and get the maximum carry.

Also if you're throwing a hook ball, you don't want to throw it too hard. Throwing too hard could cause the ball to not be able to grab the lane in time, which will cause the ball to be deflected much more by the pins and you'll leave a lot of 5 pins.

If this confuses you, talk to a bowler at your lanes that has a high average (200). They should be able to explain it to you better in person then I can on this forum.

Hope that helps!
Jay

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by a4ace:
if the 1st dot is on board 5, the center of my right foot could be on board 6. so the ball really starts on the 5th board, roll over the 1st arrow, still staying on the 5th board, </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Just to show how this is not possible..

If you slide with the center of your foot on 6, it's at least two boards to the outside of your ankle, and the since the ball rolls on the lane in the middle of the ball, it's another 5 boards to there.

So if you are sliding on 6, the ball is starting out over the gutter and you're lofting it out on to the lane and pointing it at the pocket. You're seesntially setting the ball down on the 1st board and directing it in.

You might want to take a better look at where you're sliding and where the ball is being set on the lane.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by Lefty:
You might want to take a better look at where you're sliding and where the ball is being set on the lane. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">ok. thanks. i know for a fact that the ball is released on board 5. i've never took note of where my sliding foot is. i'll take note of it next time. thanks. my approach may be moving slightly to the left. i might be surprised when i find out.

thanks snitgts. when i started using the first arrow i was mildly accelerating my swing on the release. this lands the ball on the 1-3 pocket. and i got a 5 bagger doing this. as i was playing more, i developed a faster acceleration on the release, thus sending the ball to the 1-2 pocket. i was thinking that i would be better off with this release. but after what you said, i'll try again with a milder acceleration.

snitgts: tried the milder acceleration and it didn't feel right. and as you mentioned, it still lands on the 1-2 pocket. getting strikes there but not gratifying.

lefty: had a good approach with right foot on 1st dot targeting 1st arrow. ball landed on board 5, passed the 1st arrow still on board 5, then hooked to the 1-2 pocket. looked down on my sliding foot and as you figured out, its between boards 10 and 11. so i must be subconsciously moving to the left to prepare the release of the ball on the correct board. i hope this is not a problem.

the good news is, i found where to stand. after moving all over the dots, i found my perfect strike. right foot on 2nd dot, target middle of 1st and 2nd arrow. as long as my ball goes through the middle, there's a good chance of a strike. got two turkeys after finding this spot.

now on to improving spares. currently at about 60%, 90% if the remaining pin or pins are on the left.

EDIT: sorry big mack. got to get familiar with boards. lane has 7 dots. so 2nd dot is on board 10. the ball get laid somewhere on board 9, then crosses board 7 or 8 on the arrows.

a million thanks to all.

Something else to consider... Generally speaking most house shot oil patterns are from 10 to 10(second arrow right to second arrow left). If you are laying the ball down on 5(first arrow) your ball is never in the oil. You say your ball is going to the 1-2 pocket. It sounds to me that your ball is hooking early? I would suggest to move to the second arrow where you can take advantage of the oil there to get the ball to the dry backend before it hooks.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by a4ace:

lefty: had a good approach with right foot on 1st dot targeting 1st arrow. ball landed on board 5, passed the 1st arrow still on board 5, then hooked to the 1-2 pocket. looked down on my sliding foot and as you figured out, its between boards 10 and 11. so i must be subconsciously moving to the left to prepare the release of the ball on the correct board. i hope this is not a problem.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Are you sliding on your right foot? I'd guess that you're sliding on your left foot, which accounts for a large part of the difference in where you start and where you finish.

And even if you were drifting, it's not that big of a deal as long as you consistantly do it. I drift about 8 boards. Less if I'm playing straighter.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by Lefty:
Are you sliding on your right foot? I'd guess that you're sliding on your left foot, which accounts for a large part of the difference in where you start and where you finish.

And even if you were drifting, it's not that big of a deal as long as you consistantly do it. I drift about 8 boards. Less if I'm playing straighter. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">yes, sliding on left foot. i'm right handed, using a four-step approach.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by No open tenths:
Something else to consider... Generally speaking most house shot oil patterns are from 10 to 10(second arrow right to second arrow left). If you are laying the ball down on 5(first arrow) your ball is never in the oil. You say your ball is going to the 1-2 pocket. It sounds to me that your ball is hooking early? I would suggest to move to the second arrow where you can take advantage of the oil there to get the ball to the dry backend before it hooks. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">so if my ball starts on board 9 then cross the arrows on board 7 or 8, it means my ball is still never in the oil? would it be bad for my ball?

Oil paterns, no matter if they go all the way to the gutter or not, generally only go 2/3rds the way down the lane. (40ft) So no matter if they go all the way to the gutter or not, your ball will always end up on dry lane. Lanes that have been bowled on after their last oiling could also have what's called carry-down, which is oil that is dragged down and to the outsides of the lanes by balls being thrown on them. Carry down is a common problem at night leagues as they've likely been bowled on all day. You can't see the oil on the lanes, you have to watch your ball and by its actions you can tell what it's rolling on. A ball on oil will skid, no matter how much spin you put on the ball, it won't change direction, while a ball on dry lane will hook. If you throw your ball and you expect it to hook but it keeps skidding, you likely have carry-down. Your best bet is to not worry about it, just watch your ball. If it's not getting back to the 1-3 pocket, move right and hit your same target. If it's going over to the 1-2 pocket, move left and hit your same target.

By the way, what do you mean by milder acceleration? Do you mean you throw the ball or are you snapping your wrist to make the ball spin?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by a4ace:
so if my ball starts on board 9 then cross the arrows on board 7 or 8, it means my ball is still never in the oil? would it be bad for my ball? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Nope, nothing bad will happen. But a lot of people play across the oil line to create more room. If you get it out early, it will hook earlier. If you pull it, it will hook later.

But that doesn't mean that's the way your hall is set up.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by SnitGTS:
By the way, what do you mean by milder acceleration? Do you mean you throw the ball or are you snapping your wrist to make the ball spin? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">acceleration of my arm swing during the release, when the thumb is out but my fingers are still on. the wrist remains stable.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Originally posted by a4ace:
QUOTE]acceleration of my arm swing during the release, when the thumb is out but my fingers are still on. the wrist remains stable. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="VERDANA,ARIAL,HELVETICA,TAHOMA">Ah! What you are doing is adding move revs to your ball, that explains why it crossed over to the 1-2 pocket. I was talking about ball speed. Throw the ball however it feels natural to you and then just move your feet to adjust for the target.
Good luck!
Jay

just when i thought i found my strike, something has gone different on the lane tonight. struggled the entire 1st game to find the right position again. i was hitting somewhere between 3-4. tried changing positions and target but in the end, i should have stuck to the same target moving my starting position right, like i thought i already know. so in the end of the 1st game, i found it, right foot on board 7/8, the lay and the cross on board 7/8.

at least the good news is that i accomplished my first target: a 200 game. the 2nd game was perfect, by this i mean no open frames. got only 5 strikes, 2 pairs and a loner.

full concentration on the 2nd game must have exhausted me. after concentrating hard on the spares, and the relief of accomplishing my first target, the 3rd game was a disaster. i noticed on the last frame that my wrist is already breaking. causing a helicopter like spin on my ball.

131, 209, 122.

my next target should be consistency on all three games of the leauge.

SnitGTS, not to be a smart aleck but just for general information, the tilt of the earth's axis is 23 and 1/2 degrees.

[if i stand on the first dot, do a straight approach and have the ball roll on the first arrow, my ball consistently ends on the 1-2 pocket when it hooks. i'm right handed. where is the best place to start my approach to have the ball hit the 1-3 pocket?] "a4ace"

Hello fellow Bowling fans. May I suggest "a4ace" that you purchase the Dick Ritger VHS tape. He goes into great detail about lane play, specifically where your first ball hits and how to make adjustment based on that ball information. Happy Bowling! http://www.300bowl.com/